Sunday, September 11, 2022

New Temple Predictions - September 2022 Edition

I have updated my temple prediction map in preparation for General Conference in October. Historically, data used to identify probable locations for future temples include the size of the Church in a specific geographical area (i.e. number of stakes and districts, the number of wards and branches), the age of the oldest stake in a specific geographical area, church growth trends, distance to the nearest temple, the square-footage of the nearest temple, the historical number of weekly endowment sessions scheduled at the nearest temple, and member and missionary reports regarding member activity, temple attendance, and convert retention. I have made updates to the current predictions map given recent trends in temple announcements that have favored locations distant to the nearest temple where there are at least two stakes that would be serviced by a temple. Altogether, there are 163 potential temples on the map (27 more like temples, 137 less likely temples).

Thirty-three (33) less likely locations and two more likely locations were added to the temple prediction map in September 2022. Most of these locations have not experienced significant church growth in recent years, but many of these locations appear likely candidates for a future small temple due to remote location. Many of the Church's recently announced temples have been in locations with few Latter-day Saints but where there is sufficient membership to support a small temple. Locations added to the temples prediction map for September 2022 include:

  • Resistencia, Argentina 
  • Kingman, Arizona 
  • Page, Arizona
  • Yuma, Arizona 
  • Little Rock, Arkansas
  • Araçatuba, Brazil  
  • Goiânia, Brazil 
  • Passo Fundo, Brazil 
  • Redding, California 
  • San Jose, California (more likely)
  • Santa Maria, California 
  • Santa Rosa, California
  • La Serena, Chile 
  • Rancagua, Chile
  • Bucaramanga, Colombia 
  • Medellín, Colombia
  • Otavalo, Ecuador 
  • Pensacola, Florida 
  • Düsseldorf, Germany OR Dortmund, Germany 
  • Bloomington, Illinois 
  • Acapulco, Mexico 
  • Mexicali, Mexico 
  • Poza Rica, Mexico
  • Grand Rapids, Michigan 
  • Great Falls, Montana
  • Hastings, New Zealand 
  • Wilmington, North Carolina
  • Cincinnati, Ohio Temple OR Dayton, Ohio 
  • Bend, Oregon 
  • Huánuco, Peru 
  • Barquisimeto, Venezuela 
  • Guayana City, Venezuela 
  • Valencia, Venezuela 

The following prospective temple was transferred from the less likely category to the more likely category:

  • São José, Brazil

The following 10 locations appear most likely to have temples announced this coming General Conference. You are welcome to provide your top 10 picks for temple announcements in the comments below.

  1. Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
  2. Spanish Fork, Utah 
  3. Charlotte, North Carolina
  4. Santiago/Tuguegarao Philippines
  5. Angeles or Olongapo, Philippines 
  6. Tacoma Washington
  7. Colorado Springs, Colorado 
  8. Kampala, Uganda
  9. Iquitos, Peru 
  10. São José, Brazil

See below for the map of likely and less likely new temple sites:

 

158 comments:

Kenny said...

Being that I and many others predict about 17 temples to be announced this conference, I picked my top 17. In no particular order.

Bakersfield, California
Flagstaff, Arizona
Lehi, Utah
Spanish Fork, Utah
Las Cruces, NM/ El Paso, TX
Colorado Springs, Colorado
Jacksonville, Florida
Kingston, Jamaica
Maracaibo, Venezuela
Chiclayo, Peru
Iquitos, Peru
Kampala, Uganda
Abuja, Nigeria
Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
Surakarta, Indonesia
Davenport, Australia
Glasgow, Scotland

James said...

A lot of these "less likely" options have only 3 stakes in their prospective district, and many of those would take away from temples that only have ~6 in their existing district. Only 5 current temples have 2-3 stakes/districts in their district.

If a Bloomington IL temple is created, for example, it leaves the Nauvoo temple with only 4 stakes. Add the Des Moines temple (which admittedly makes much more sense since it's at least in a city with a stake center, unlike Bloomington) and Nauvoo is left with two stakes.

Same thing with Little Rock as a location. You take all three of those stakes away from Memphis and they're left with only 3 stakes.

Is this where things are headed? 2-3 stakes per temple outside of areas with high concentrations of members? How exactly are the members supposed to provide the people needed to run a temple with only 2-3 stakes to draw from? Temples open once a week or something?

Anonymous said...

@James,

I suspect temples will largely be built where at least 3 stakes are expected to be served in and for the foreseeable future. My rational is practical and also borrows from the imagery of stakes holding up the temple tent. A minimum of 3 stakes are needed to hold up a tent. I would guess this analogy will eventually give way to temples everywhere, but I’d guess not for a while.

Anonymous said...

Top 10 Temple Guesses:
-Bakersfield, CA
-Cincinnati, OH
-Charlotte, NC
-Chiclayo, Peru
-Joao Pessoa, Brazil
-Ribeiro Preto, Brazil
-Rosario, Argentina
-Uyo, Nigeria
-Osaka, Japan
-Santiago, Philippines

I’m guessing 18 are announced in October, so my 8 additional top pics are:
-Jacksonville, FL
-Maracaibo, Venezuela
-Samoa
-Santiago, Dominican Republic
-Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
-Cuaulta, Mexico
-Vina Del Mar, Chile
-Scotland

Сњешко said...

Since it seems that there is likely to be more than 10 temples announced this conference, I decided to up my picks to 15. Anyway here is my list for this upcoming conference:

1. Charolette, North Carolina
2. Springville/Spanish Fork/Mapleton, Utah
3. Flagstaff, Arizona
4. Cincinnati, Ohio
5. North-Western El Salvador
6. Poza Rica, Mexico
7. Monclova, Mexico
8. Teresina, Brazil
9. Kampala, Uganda
10. Takoradi, Ghana
11. Abuja, Nigeria
12. Santiago, Phillipines
13. Tirana, Albania
14. White Tank Mountain (Surprise/Goodyear), Arizona
15. Chiclayo, Peru

Fredrick said...

I seem to always get burned the last couple of conferences with these predictions, but here is goes anyway:

1. Spanish Fork / Springville, UT
2. Lehi, UT
3. Charlotte, NC
4. Cincinatti, OH
5. El Paso, TX / Las Cruces, NM
6. Iquitos, Peru
7. Jacksonville, FL
8. Riberao Preto, Brazil
9. Colorado Springs, CO
10. Ulanbataar, Mongolia
11. Bakersfield, CA
12. Vina Del Mar / Valparaiso, Chile
13. Edinburgh / Glasgow, Scotland
14. Milwaukee, Wisconsin
15. Grand Rapids, Michigan
16. Buena Vista, Virginia
17. Angeles, Philippines
18. Price, Utah
19. Flagstaff, Arizona
20. Uyo, Nigeria

Fredrick said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...

I know a lot of folks are expecting ~20 temples announced this time, for various reasons. I'm going to make a slightly more conservative guess and predict a dozen. My predictions, more-or-less in order of how likely I think they are, are as follows:

Kampala, Uganda
Port Harcourt, Nigeria
Florianopolis, Brazil (or São José, which is right next to Florianopolis -- I assume that of the several São Josés in Brazil this is the one Matt is referring to in his post)
Chiclayo, Peru
Osorno, Chile
Rosario, Argentina
Lehi, Utah
Naga, Philippines
Ribeirao Preto, Brazil
Santa Ana, El Salvador
Glasgow, Scotland (or Edinburgh, I could see either one, but not both)
Tacoma, Washington

Unknown said...

I maintain a list looking out several years ahead and of the ones on Matt's top 10 list that are not on my list above (which I forgot to sign, apologies), quite a few are ones that I predict for General Conference this coming April, including Iquitos, Ulaanbaatar, Spanish Fork, and Colorado Springs, so if there are more than a dozen those are some that I would consider likely to also be announced.

--Felix

Whizzbang said...

The Winnipeg Temple has two stakes in the temple district. They split the stake two weeks after the temple was dedicated. I don't know if I have any other ones other than what previous posters has listed but I would second or third Scotland, Indonesia, Mongolia, possibly another in Lima Peru.

Bryan Dorman said...

I'm going to guess 10 temples, could be more, could be less.

United States (Top 5):

Farmington UT
Bakersfield CA
Charlotte NC
Jackson MS
Tulsa OK


International (Top 5):
Cancún MX
Iquitos PE
Florianópolis BR
Ullanbattar MN
Yamousoukkro CI


Darkhorses:

Neuquen AR
Punta Arenas CL (this has more destinations from around the region than Ushuaia AR)
Campo Grande BR OR Cuiaba BR (Campo Grande has more nearby stakes but Cuiaba would be more centrally located)
Poza Rica MX
Medellín CO

anonymous said...

If Pres. Nelson announces 18 temples, that would get us to the 300 total temple mark. I see that as a strong possibility for October.

TOP 18

1. Ulaanbaatar Mongolia
2. Colorado Springs, Colorado
3. Iquitos, Peru
4. Herriman, Utah
5. Tierra del Fuego (Punta Arenas / Ushuaia)
6. Ribeirão Preto, Brazil
7. Uyo, Nigeria
8. Alamosa, Colorado
9. Angeles, Philippines
10. Queen Creek, Arizona
11. Flagstaff, Arizona
12. Portland, Maine
13. Kanab, Utah
14. Kampala, Uganda
15. Richfield, Utah
16. Christchurch, New Zealand
17. Edinburgh, Scotland
18. Warsaw, Poland


I think there is a strong possibility to see the 10k sq. ft. temple design in a lot more locations similar to Elko, NV. Two Stakes with longer distances to access current temple assignment:

Flagstaff, Arizona
Kanab, Utah
St. David, Arizona
Alamosa, Colorado
Gilmer, Texas
Evanston, Wyoming
Coalville, Utah
Driggs, Idaho
Gallup, New Mexico

Islands

Majuro, Marshall Islands
Hobart, Tasmania
Las Palmas, Canary Islands
St. Johns, Newfoundland

High Growth / High Concentration of members:

Queen Creek, Arizona (90k sq. ft.)
Buena Vista, Virginia (40k sq. ft.)
Surprise, Arizona (40k sq. ft.)

Long Shots

Dublin, Ireland
Belfast, Northern Ireland
Ottawa, Ontario
Milan, Italy
Moncton, New Brunswick

And I have been surprised that there has not been a 2nd (or even a several more) temples announced for the Las Vegas area? Possible locations could include Centennial Hills in the north, Summerlin to the west and Green Valley to the south of the current Las Vegas Temple location.

anonymous said...
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anonymous said...
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Anita Wells said...

I echo the Buena Vista VA votes!

Pascal Friedmann said...

I am on a work break on my phone and will offer a more detailed discussion later, but I just could not wait to share my thoughts.

Thank you for adding a temple for central Illinois to the list! I did not expect it to be Bloomington (which does not have a stake) but it is worth discussing. The truth is that this general area is awkwardly positioned between two temples (St Louis and Indianapolis) and would include three stakes in central Illinois. That seems to pass the "tent" test. I find it intriguing but still believe that Champaign would probably be able to provide more workers and patrons attending at least on a weekly basis than Bloomington.

Nauvoo would likely not lose that much by shedding Peoria from its district, for two reasons: 1) Nauvoo is largely a tourist temple that is painful to get to from anywhere in Illinois, including Peoria. Some of Iowa and Missouri will be better positioned to attend there than in Des Moines, but at some point we will just have to acknowledge how impractical it is to get to Nauvoo for most local members on the Illinois side. It is more than two hours from Galesburg/Monmouth, which is where you get off the freeway if you are coming from Peoria, and almost three hours from the Quad Cities. 2) I know for a fact that members in Peoria and especially Bloomington prefer going to Indianapolis over Nauvoo, especially in the winter.

And yes, outside of the summer tourist season, Nauvoo is fairly poorly attended as is, but in my opinion it is going to be smarter to scale down operations there during the winter as opposed to not building a more convenient "everyday local members temple" in central Illinois or Iowa.

EP said...

Well, I missed on every temple announced last time, so I'm just gonna paste my predictions from last time and call it good.

October 2022
Edinburgh/Glasgow, Scotland (M)
Abuja, Nigeria (S)
Kampala, Uganda
Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia (XS)
Naga/Legazpi, Philippines (M)
Osaka, Japan (M)
Iquitos, Peru (XS)
Teresina, Brazil (M)
Fairbanks, AK (XS)
Flagstaff/Prescott, AZ (M)
Charlotte, NC (L2)
Colorado Springs, CO (L)
Coeur d’Alene/Post Falls/Hayden, ID (M)
Herriman, UT (14852 Juniper Crest site) (XL/2X/3X)

Dark horse: Summerlin Las Vegas, Nevada

The Sweden renovation is quite interesting, it looks like much like Frankfurt, they'll put in a full basement to get to that size doubling. Probably the baptistry in the basement with the endowment/sealing rooms up on the main floor. I think we'll see more of the six-spire international temples remodeled this way over time.

Kimberley in San Diego said...

In addition to temple announcements, is there anything else you are predicting for General Conference? They certainly have become more exciting since President Nelson became the prophet.

EP said...

Heard an interesting rumor with a well-connected source that the Church has picked up 37 acres in Rigby across from the high school, which was once planned to be Farmington Station, a mixed-use development. My understanding is that the Church does not have the same intentions for this parcel as planned previously.

As always, grain of salt and all that.

John Pack Lambert said...

Marinus Larsen, who was a member of the Utah State legislature, the first bishop of the Spanish Fork 3rd Ward when Spanish Fork got multiple wards, and mayor of Spanish Fork is up for proposed deletion. This means anyone (except me because of topic editing limits), can remove the tag, and force it at least to an AfD. Wikipedia notability guidelines say that all members of state legislatures are notable, so unless someone wants to change those rules, Larsen passes notability guidelines.

There is a very similar nomination against the article on Michael Hicks (musicologist), a I believe now retired BYU professor who wrote a book on the history of music in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and later what he called a "biography" of the Tabernacle Choir at Temple Square. I am not sure that the sources on him are quite enough, but I am sure if should be put to ful discussion, it is not a clear enough case to justify a Prod deletion.

John Pack Lambert said...

I think there will be at least 18 temples announced. That would get us to an even 300. I sort of suspect that based on what President Nelson has told us was the process of announcing the Bangalaru India Temple, there will end up being more than 18 temples announced, but I am sticking with 18 for my predictions.

1. Abuja, Nigeria - capital, not close to existing or announced temples, 3 stakes
2. Lehi, Utah - there is so much growth here, I think it is needed even with a Saratoga Springs Temple going up
3. Herriman, Utah - growth justifies this one as well
4. Appleton, Wisconsin - I think this is the best location for serving Wisconsin and the Upper Peninsula of Michigan
5. Grand rapids, Michigan - it would serve 4 stakes plus a district, and with Michigan having gone from 8 stakes and a district to 10 stakes and a district in the last 2 years I think it is doable
6. Charlotte, North Carolina - Columbia has a high number of stakes for its space, and Knoxville will only maybe take 1 stake from Columbia, Charlotte needs a temple, Greensboro and somewhere in the east are much more further in the future
7. San Jose, California - with the level of traffic and number of members (even with recent stake loss) in the area around San Francisco Bay, I think a second temple in San Jose is justified
8. Angeles, Phillipines - if there are more than 18 announcements, I would think the Phillipines might get 2
9. Kampala, Uganda - Uganda is the country with the most stakes without a temple announced, I believe also the most members.
10. Chiclayo, Peru - Chiclayo has I think 7 stakes, so this seems a high contestant.
11. Iquitos, Peru - it has enough stakes for a small temple, and is super isolated
12. San Jose/Florianopolis/Joinville, Brazil - Joinville is an outside candidate, but someone in Eastern Santa Catarina State Brazil for sure.
13. Joao Pesso, Brazil - this is the place in northern Brazil I pick, but it might end up being Natal.
14. Ebinburgh, Scotland - I really think Scotland will get a temple announced, I am not as set on the location.
15. Hamburg, Germany - I think a temple here is needed.
16. Busan, South Korea.
17. Cancun, Mexico
18. Ha'apai Group, Tonga

David McFadden said...

Of course everything is going to be announced via revelation. But my guess.
- 1-3 stakes in new temple district. Where these stakes are extremely isolated requiring flights and/or overnight travel to its current temple.
- 4-8 stakes. Where the nearest exiting temple is 2-6 hour travel.
- 8+ stakes. where a temple is less than 2 hours away and even more if an existing temple is within an hours drive.

My thoughts are that temples will be announced, but at a slower pace than the last few conferences, although President Neilson has surprised me on each of the last few conferences.

Where we may expect announcements
Mongolia
Fairbanks/North Pole Alaska
Charlotte NC
Somewhere on Luzon Island (main island) Philippines.
Nigeria
Bakersfield
Tacoma
João Pessoa Brazil
Glasgow Scotland
Murcia Spain
Osaka Japan
Another Utah temple
Buena Vista, VA (Southern Virginia University) - A LDS dominated college not located by a temple.

John Pack Lambert said...

One thing to keep in mind is that Las Vegas Temple has over 80,000 square feet. I personally think a Kingman, Temple would be more likely than a second temple for anywhere in Metro Las Vegas. Las Vegas is basically twice the size of Dallas, but at present has roughly the same number of stakes in the temple district (to be fair Fort Worth while take several stakes from Dallas, and Austin may take some from Dallas as well, but Austin is mainly taking from San Antonio).

I could be wrong, but I just do not see Metro Las Vegas getting a temple anytime soon. I would guess the second temple in Clark County would be in Logandale, but I do not think that temple is quite ready to be announced.

L. Chris Jones said...

I hope for Ulaanbaatar Mongolia
Charlotte North Carolina,
San Jose California
Jakarta Indonesia (or its new capital but I think he government may move but most of the population will stay.
Nigeria, Ghana will get new announcements soon.
Ireland and Scotland
Marshal Islands
Iowa
El Paso TX or Las Cruses NM
Busan S. Korea
1 or 2 in the Philippines
Price Utah
anywhere Mexico
Anywhere Brazil
Neuquén Argentina
Punts Arenas or Tierra del Fuego regions of Argentina or Chile
Iquitos or central Peru
Tasmania Australia (Hobart?)
South Island of New Zealand
Jamaica
Dominican Republic #2
Santa Ana El Salvador
Uganda
Osaka Japan
Vermont, New Hampshire, or Maine
Somewhere in Wisconsin (Greenbay or Madison?)

L. Chris Jones said...

On August 3, 2022: eastidahonews.com reported the following news article: (second article on the page, bottom half).

www.eastidahonews.com/2022/08/biz-buzz-gluten-free-bakery-opens-in-idaho-falls/#:~:text=RIGBY%20%E2%80%93%20A%2073-acre%20parcel%20of%20land%20across,ID%20Highway%2048%20in%20Rigby%2C%20in%20January%202021.

LDS Church buys property in Rigby
RIGBY – A 73-acre parcel of land across from Rigby High School was recently purchased by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Andrew and Jorelle McClellan with Silvercreek Realty Group bought Farmington Station, which surrounds Dansie Dental on ID Highway 48 in Rigby, in January 2021. They were originally planning to turn it into a mixed-use development with residential housing on the back 10 acres and commercial space occupying the rest of it.

RELATED | Biz Buzz: New development project in Rigby getting mixed reactions from community

The project never moved forward, but public records obtained from Jefferson County indicate the church bought it. It’s unclear what it plans to do with it. Larry Fisher, a church representative for the Pocatello area, tells EastIdahoNews.com Latter-day Saint leaders don’t typically discuss these details with the public.
Could this be for a temple? This is a lot of acres. the church has made some temples part of a mixed use development.

Butterfly and Bones said...

I'm also guessing a magical 18 (in no particular order):

Chihualua, Mexico
Chiclayo, Peru
Iquitos, Peru
Vina de Mar, Chile
Neuquén, Argentina
Joao Pessoa, Brazil
Edinburgh, Scotland
Port Harcourt, Nigeria
Kampala, Uganda
Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
Busan, S. Korea
Osaka, Japan
Marshall Islands
Hobart Tasmania, Australia

USA:

Queen's Creek, AZ
Colorado Springs, CO
Charlotte, NC
Spanish Fork, UT

Taylor said...

@James --

I've gotta confess, I'm just ticked pink to see Bloomington, IL show up on the list at all, having grown up there a few decades ago. There are some awesome saints in the area who would happily staff a temple several days a week.

The interesting thing about Bloomington is the fact that it's almost dead center between four other temples, all of which are three hours away on the highway. Chicago was built when I was a teenager, and was ONLY three hours away (roughly ten hours closer than our previous temple, in Washington D.C.) Many years later, in the late 90's, St. Louis was built three hours in the opposite direction along the same interstate 55, and my parents' stake moved into that temple district. A few years later, Nauvoo was built three hours to the west, and they again were moved to the new temple district. In 2015, Indianapolis was dedicated three hours to the east (but Bloomington remained in the Nauvoo Temple district.) So yeah... when President Monson announced in general conference in 2011 that 85% of the membership of the church lived within 200 miles of a temple, we smiled a bit, knowing that Bloomington sat toward the edge of several of those 200-mile circles. :-)

My understanding is that the overall demographic trend these days is migration *out* of Illinois, based on a remarkably hostile business climate. One of the largest (if not the largest) businesses in Bloomington has historically been the world headquarters of State Farm Insurance, but State Farm has opened large offices in the Phoenix area and offered attractive packages to many (thousands of) employees to relocate. And State Farm is not the only major corporation bailing out of Illinois.

So if anything, Bloomington (or Illinois in general) may not be growing rapidly these days. A temple in Bloomington might change that trend a bit for church members, specifically, but as much as I'd love to see a temple in my home town, I'm not holding my breath.

But again... It's fun to see it in the list, at least!

Christopher Duerig said...

Elder and Sister Soares recently had a Ministerial visit to Porto Portugal.

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders/2022/9/13/23350857/elder-ulisses-soares-and-sister-soares-marvel-in-return-to-portugal

As with several previous high leadership travels to distant locations prior to Conferences, I wonder if they had time to view a possible site for a future 2nd location in Potugal for a temple to be built in Porto, to be announced . Maybe not in this conference but in the next or future conferences.

Thoughts?

Anonymous said...

I thought a Rigby temple would be announced shortly after the Pocatello Temple dedication, but that was before the Teton River temple was announced. Then I thought a Rigby temple would be announcement within a year (+/-) of Teton River's completion. Now, after hearing about a recent land purchase in Rigby, I'm thinking a temple in Rigby could very well be announced at any time.

When I attended the Rexburg Temple groundbreaking, Elder John Groberg, the presiding general authority, quoted a handful of prophesies from early church leaders stating that numerous temples will be built in the valley. I think the references were about the valley in south eastern Idaho, but it may have included the whole snake river valley that extends all the way to Boise.

Butterfly and Bones said...

Oh, snaps... I forgot about the Philippines from my list of 18. (It's so tough to narrow it down to a "Top X Amount," & I can't believe so many of you were able to narrow it down to 10 or so!) How fortunate we are to live in a time where it's not a stretch to create a list of 18!
I guess if I were to stick to a magical 18, I would remove Spanish Fork, UT from my original list to include one of the following: Angeles/Santiago/Naga, Philippines. I know a Utah Temple and a Filipino Temple have no factor on each other in real life and there is no "magical" number -- this is just for funsies.
-Tacoma, WA -- I forgot to put this on my top 18 list (like the Philippines). This should be up there! Long overdue! The Pacific Northwest is so expensive and quite dangerous to drive with all that rain. I'm not sure why this hasn't been announced yet to be honest -- unless it’s meant to be announced after Moses Lake is dedicated? In any case, I would exchange the Marshall Islands on my original list for Tacoma, Washington
-Santa Ana, El Salvador -- I actually meant for this to be on my top 18 (like Tacoma, WA & a Filipino pick). Oops. **I would exchange Hobart, Tasmania (Australia) from my original list for Santa Ana, El Salvador
Corrections to my Top 18 List:
Remove:
-Spanish Fork, Utah
-Marshall Islands
-Hobart, Tasmania (Australia)
Add to my Top 18 List:
- Angeles/Santiago/Naga, Philippines
-Tacoma, Washington
-Santa Ana, El Salvador

Butterfly and Bones said...

Honorable Mentions in the USA:
-Fairbanks, AK - sheer isolation, but decided to hold off on this choice
-Las Vegas #2 - decided to wait on this b/c Elko was just announced, but it's needed (tbh, I don’t know why it’s not already announced)
-Bakersfield, CA - I think this will be announced in April after Feather River, CA is dedicated
-Nampa or Blackfoot, ID – just seems like one of the random, but mandatory ID announcements that would be made (both have # of stakes to be feasible)
-Des Moines, IA - Iowa is bound to get a temple in the near future, but others seemed more imminent
-Milwaukee, WI – I know Green Bay is the more popular choice, but Milwaukee just seemed more centrally located to the rest of WI & accessible in terms of the highway systems. In any case, I think WI is due for a temple, others just seemed more imminent
-Charleston, WV – If WV were to be announced, I think it would have to wait until after Cleveland & Pittsburgh temples were dedicated
-Jacksonville, FL - I reckon that Jacksonville won't be announced until after Tallahassee is dedicated, but then again, Tampa was announced
-Augusta, ME - isolated, but it seems like we're slowing announcing things for the East coast so I prioritized Charlotte, NC this go-around
-Spanish Fork, UT – Originally was on my top 18 list, but I removed it to make room for a Filipino pick. I think this = #1 for Utah pick due to # of stakes in SF/Springville region
-Lehi, UT - The Church has been rumored to have acquired the land near Micron, but I didn't include it on the list b/c I figured I'd wait until after Saratoga Springs was dedicated
-Herriman/Cottonwood Heights - waiting until after Taylorsville is dedicated, but the E & S side of SL county seem to be ripe for the pickings
-Tremonton, UT – a nice cluster of stakes far enough (in UT terms) from a temple, but I’d wait until after Smithfield to predict this
-N. Farmington/S. Kaysville, UT - a nice cluster of stakes far enough (in UT terms) from a temple, but I’d wait until after both Layton AND Syracuse to predict this

Butterfly and Bones said...

International Honorable Mentions:
-Cancun/Poza Riza/Acapulco, MX - I simply prioritized Chihuahua over these b/c Chihuahua seemed more remote
-Kingston, Jamaica – I think this one might be announced after San Juan, Puerto Rico is dedicated so maybe in April 2023
-Machala, Ecuador - just waiting until April 2023, after the Quito temple is dedicated
-Maracaibo & Valencia Venezuela - I think both are needed, but won't happen due to political reasons so I categorized as honorable mentions atm
-Piura/Tacna/Hyancayo, Peru - just thought Chiclayo & Iquitos are long overdue so I thought these ones could wait
-Osorno/Valdivia, Chile -- I ultimately went w/Vina del Mar this go-around purely based on # of stakes, but I wouldn't be surprised if Osorno/Valdivia (or Temaco/Los Angeles, or all the way down to Puenta Arenas), was announced, but figured only one would be called this GC, & went w/Vina del Mar because of # of stakes
-Buenas Aires #2, Argentina - I think this will undoubtedly happen b/c of trends to announce 2nd temples in large cities, but I went w/Neuquén this time b/c it seems very isolated
-Rosario, Argentina – B/c Bahia Blanca is just getting started & Salta is still in the works, I don't think this will be called for awhile... at least not until after a Buenas Aires #2. Ultimately, I went w/Neuquén for reasons stated above
-Rivera/Artigas Stake, Uruguay - this general area of the map, split between Brazil, seems like a large gap w/o a temple, & I arbitrarily decided Uruguay would get it since Brazil is a big country & will have lot of opportunities for temples whereas Uruguay does not, but decided it's not going to be announced this GC since S. America will have a lot announced
-Florianopolis, Brazil - This one was on my top 18, but I bumped it for Joao Pessoa, but realistically, I think both could be on my top 18
-Natal, Brazil - I couldn't decide between Joao Pessoa & Natal for northern Brazil. J.P. clearly has the most # of stakes so I went with J.P., but I won't be surprised if Natal is chosen instead because J.P. is closer to a temple (Recife)
-Ribeirao Preto/Teresino/Campo Grande/Cuiaba/Rio Branco, Brazil -- tbh, there's simply a lot of remote Brazil areas in need of a temple, but I just put Joao Pessoa on my top 18 b/c of the large concentration of stakes
-Abuja, Nigeria - I almost put this on the top 18 b/c it’s the capital of Nigeria, & it’s far away from Lagos, Benin City, & Aba (locations of temples) so it makes sense to spread out the temples in Nigeria, but ultimately I went w/Port Harcourt b/c of the larger cluster of stakes there (figured by the time a temple is dedicated in Port Harcourt, it might be extremely dense, but tbh, Nigeria probably could use both!)
-Uyo, Nigeria -tbh, Nigeria could probably use all 3 (!) temple announcements even though Lagos & Benin City are still in the approval phase. However, I don't think we would get 3 temple announcements for Nigeria in one GC so I just went w/Port Harcourt for now, but I think any of them are fair game – at the same time, I won't be surprised if we don't get any until Lagos and Benin City are further along in the process
-Cape Coast, Ghana - when the Kumasi temple is much further along (at least beyond the approval phase), I expect this to be announced
-Marshall Islands – I removed this from my top 18 to make room for Tacoma, WA on the list, but I think for Pacific Islands, this would be the top contender
-Hobart, Tasmania (Australia) – I removed this from my top 18 to make room for Santa Ana, El Salvador. I do think this is a likely choice, especially since it is remote and with all the attention New Zealand is getting, makes you wonder where is the love for is Australia? haha

James said...

I heard through several sources that, for the foreseeable future, President Nelson's plan is to announce a minimum of 35 temples per year. That would mean, as others have mentioned, that at least 18 would be announced. So after I took time to consider what I had heard, either personally or through other sources available to me, regarding the ever-changing parameters of temple announcements, and after taking a look back at the announcements of the 100 temples by President Nelson thus far, I took time to update my overall list, which shows every feasible possibility I could see for the upcoming General Conference. That list can be found in the following document:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QPM4ofjB-6V4lf6A7McBlLjJMqLT0mcsqkiP6ZHFRz4/edit

But in view of the fact that we can probably expect a minimum of 18 temples to be announced, I have also gone through the larger list to pick out the top contenders for each area in which I feel most strongly that a temple could be announced. The more specific list of exact locations I anticipate can be found in the following document:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1AHEJOqAjEJDN7aXQLlfrkzc2yTVer6E0TRR5eYdNKB8/edit?usp=sharing

Regarding the more specific list, since it pertains to the upcoming conference, it will be at the bottom of the document in question. I would like to invite public comments on either or both lists, but since this blog requires comment moderation, since mine does not, I'd prefer if any such questions or comments were submitted in the threads of the following blog post:

https://stokessoundsoff.blogspot.com/2022/09/breaking-news-first-presidency.html

My thanks once again to you all.

James said...

Kimberley, regarding your question of other General Conference predictions, as President Oaks announced in April, the Saturday Evening Sessions will have a new format:

Introductory Message

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2022/04/31oaks?lang=eng

Based on that, I'm thinking the Sunday School General President may conduct that session. I also have wondered if, given fluctuating levels of Church growth in various places, an announcement either in this conference or next April could be the realignment of most or all areas of the Church, or that one or two Apostles will be sent out to directly oversee certain areas that are struggling. We may also at some point get new status reports on the new global hymnbook and children's songbook.

And since a renovation for the Logan Utah Temple has not yet been detailed, we may get an update on when that information is coming.

Hope these thoughts are helpful.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

If Great Falls gets a temple, then I hope Kalispell isn't far behind. Though I would be happy to see one up in Charlie Russell Country. I've got a good friend from there.

Nancy said...

Here are my predictions/wishes for temple announcements:

Lehi/Herriman
Price/Spanish Fork
Tacoma WA
Las Vegas #2 (Henderson)
Colorado Springs CO
Charlotte NC
Flagstaff AZ
Rapid City SD, a wish, not very likely
Appleton, WI
Iquitos, Peru
Angeles, Philippines
Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
Edinburgh or Glasgow, Scotland
Kampala, Uganda
Cote d’Ivoire
Brazil-several possible locations
Punta Arenas, Argentina
Santa Ana, El Salvador

I'm expecting to be surprised by some unexpected locations. Pres. Nelson's MO!

Jim Anderson said...

The conference sessions will all be conducted by the First Presidency, the other officers speakon a rotting basis, apostles and First Presidency members speak once, President Nelson usually open, Sunday morning, and the Sunday afternoon which is where the temples usually end up being announced.

The hymnbook is still a major ongoing project. They only took two years the last time but they also want to do a better job of putting it together than the last time. No one who has submitted to that has heard one way or the other, although over a year ago the rumor got around that someone had heard. That proved untrue.

Another temple rumor says '(about) 40 a year', no source, although a stake conference was the apparent setting that resulted in that rumor.

Lehi has that planning meeting where a developer said that they were contracted with the church for some land in the development for a 'centerpiece project', some discovered a parcel large enough with a much smaller one set aside for a meetinghouse near northern Lehi.

The Rigby rumor follows the north Rexburg rumors, large tract of land most to be used for other purposes. Deseret Peak followed that same pattern and when t had to be moved a builder gave the church that land and will later build around it.

We have four possibles then for Utah, so which will go first? 13 temples are in full-scale construction or renovation, with one likely to be completed in a couple months making one crew available for a different job. Heber Valley has not had a site chosen yet so that may be one where they send one of the work crew companies to work on building it. Only one in Utah most likely so which do we think will go first?



Brett Stirling said...

If Tasmania, Hobart has a great location.

https://www.churchesoftasmania.com/2020/11/no-824-rosny-church-of-jesus-christ-of.html?m=1

I think if New Zealand was go get another temple, it would be in Christchurch before Hastings.

Butterfly and Bones said...

I do not think a Canadian location is likely (I'm just Canadian so I'm dreaming), but now that Winnipeg is finally dedicated, where would others predict the next Canadian location?

If I had to guess, I would say: Lethbridge, Alberta.

But if I were to REALLY dream, I would secretly hope for Victoria, British Columbia because Vancouver, BC was never practical for Vancouver Island (where I live) in terms of time, money, & travel type. (However, compared to the rest of the world outside of the USA -- heck, many parts of Canada, I know I am pretty spoiled - it just takes the combo of Fri night & Saturday)! We can be patient.

Butterfly and Bones said...

@Jim, I think you are quite right that the next crew (after Saratoga Springs is dedicated) would be sent to Heber Valley. When do we think Layton/Orem/Taylorsville/Red Cliffs will be completed/dedicated? Or St. George re-dedicated? I reckon that that at least 2-3 of those will also finish next year, but maybe only one (in addition to Saratoga Springs) by next April - maybe? I may be too hopeful.

But in any case, I like your theory, if we can only choose one UT pick, which one.

First I wanted to clarify, what do you mean by: "We have four possibles then for Utah, so which will go first?" 4 Possible (top) UT Predictions? Or next (after Saratoga Springs) to be dedicated (i.e. Layton/Orem/Taylorsville/Red Cliffs)?

If it's next after Saratoga Springs to be dedicated, I'm guessing Layton.

If it's top 4 possible locations for next UT announcement, I've guessed:
1. Spanish Fork (general area -- could betwixt Springville area)
2. Lehi (northern area -- although I appreciate your clarification of the rumor that perhaps the plot of land for the "Church centerpiece" was maybe just for a Church chapel -- but at the same time, Lehi has seen explosive growth)
3. Herriman (that persistent prediction stemming back to Hinckley's comment - it's time to be fulfilled!)
4. Price (Hwy 89 is dangerous, particularly during the snow)

My Honorable Mentions:
-N. Farmington/.S.Kaysville
-Tremonton/Garland (haven't seen this on anyone else's list, but I'm not sure why this little cluster couldn't get one)
-Cottonwood Height/Sandy

John Pack Lambert said...

The last time they revised the hymnbook the initial announcement was made in 1973, so 12 years before it was published. True, that plan was scrapped, but it still was a key backbone to what was eventually produced.

Also, this new program is to produce the same hymnbook in a lot of languages simultaneously. It is also trying to broaden the scope of the hymns in ways that the 1970s project sought, but the 1980s project did not really deliver on.

We could see the new hymnbook debuted this conference. It has been in progress now for over 4 years. However I would not be surprised if it takes longer.

Mon Chou said...

Thanks, Brett! I really appreciated that. I looked at Google maps, and the Rosny location in Hobart still has stunning views even today despite being smack in suburbia because of it's placement on the hill. That would certainly be a marvelous location. A def light on the hill

Mon Chou said...

I'm like you; whenever I see ministerial visits to distant locations prior to conferences, my curiosity piques. I think Porto is a good one one to have on our radar in the next several conferences.

I'm European so I'm just curious where you think the next European announcement would be (outside the ever popular & expected Scotland and Ireland picks).

I know we are small in number, but the temples sure strengthen us and may help the youth/young adults if they had more access to temples. Not sure? Many of my sibling in-laws and my own siblings are in this age group and have left the Church, but we were always the only members in our communities so we had no friends our age group. I would hope Temples would help them have eternal perspectives at a younger age so smaller temples throughout Europe would be great, but not sure if we have the staff for it? I hope so!

James said...

Jim Anderson, your statement about the First Presidency conducting all sessions is actually outdated. In his “Introductory Message” to open the Women’s Session in April, President Oaks noted the following: “For now, this Saturday evening meeting is a session of general conference, not a session of any organization. Like all sessions of general conference, the planning, speakers, and music are designated by the First Presidency.

“We have asked President Jean B. Bingham, General President of the Relief Society, to conduct this session. Future Saturday evening sessions may be conducted by one of the other General Officers of the Church, such as members of the General Presidencies of Relief Society, Young Women, and Primary, designated by the First Presidency.

Quite a few people missed that part of his message. If you go back in the history of the Womens’ Sessions, those have always been conducted by a member of the Relief Society, Young Women, or Primary General Presidencies, which also applied to just about every one of the General Young Women and Relief Society Meetings that had been held the Saturday prior to General Conference weekend.

Exact words matter. So while the First Presidency will have final approval for speakers and music for Saturday Evening Sessions going forward, as President Oaks indicated: “future Saturday evening sessions may be conducted by one of the General Officers of the Church”.

Although he mentioned only the general presidencies led by females, I know that there was a recent devotional in which President Nelson and a member of the Quorum of the Twelve spoke, and Brother Ahmad S. Corbitt, First Counselor in the Young Men General Presidency, conducted that devotional.

So it was an understood practice in recent decades that, with the exception of sessions for women, all sessions of General Conference have indeed been conducted by a member of the First Presidency. But as President Oaks also stated in his message: “The gospel of Jesus Christ does not change. Gospel doctrine does not change. Our personal covenants do not change. But over the years, the meetings we hold to communicate our messages do change and very likely will continue to change over the years.”

Later on, he stated: “What we are initiating here is responsive to the communication resources currently available to the Lord’s worldwide Church leadership and membership. The doctrine of the gospel of Jesus Christ is for everyone, so that is our principal motive and extent of dissemination.”

I actually covered this address on my blog over General Conference weekend, because it marked the first Nelsonian-era change in policy and practice that was not detailed by the prophet himself, but by his right-hand man, President Oaks:

https://stokessoundsoff.blogspot.com/2022/04/breaking-news-new-guidelines-and.html

Hope that helps to explain why I stated that I’m predicting Brother Pace will conduct the Saturday Evening Session this time around. That being said, I agree fully with everything else you noted.

Pascal Friedmann said...

I think both Lethbridge and Victoria are likely candidates within Canada.

Jim Anderson said...

I know a number of people on Facebook who have submitted for the hymnbook, I also did, and none of us have heard. Someone did find out that when they finalize things they will first get back with the composers and authors to be sure what was given them in 2018 and 2019 are what was intended and for any minor issues or other work that may for whatever reasons be needed.

Back to Utah temples, my question was which location for a new temple is likely to be the one or possibly even two to be announced first, possibly at this conference?

Bill Stanton said...

Just some rumors that I have heard. Most of them are related to my local area of Idaho.
I have heard of land bring purchased in Blackfoot and Rigby. Nampa or Eagle would not surprise me. But I think the most likely is Coeur d'Alene. It is in the Spokane, WA temple district which currently has 19 stakes and is 10,000 sq ft temple. Moses Lake will take some, Missoula will take 3 more, but it seems to be booked solid. Hard to get an appointment.

Also heard the church bought an amazing pieces of land in Fairbanks, Alaska and in Ireland.

Whizzbang said...

@Butterfly and Bones-I too am Canadian! I too don't expect another temple in Canada anytime soon. A place I wonder about though and it would small if they ever build one there is Prince George, BC. Hasten the day that there is a temple in the NWT and the Yukon-now, I think there are a couple of branches but distance wise it would be great if they had one

EP said...

Trying to predict the order of Utah announcements is a grade A crapshoot. You could realistically double the number of temples in Utah still from today's 28 and probably still need new temples by the time you got through those 28.

I see in the next 5-10 years announcements for the following locations in Utah:
Herriman
Spanish Fork
Lehi
Price
North Ogden/Pleasant View
Sandy/Cottonwood/East Salt Lake Valley
Hurricane/Washington City
Morgan
Delta
Eagle Mountain
Tremonton (@Butterfly and Bones I totally agree with you that this makes sense, but is probably just a little further down the priority list unless Brigham is at capacity and needs relief sooner)
Farmington
Roy
Hyrum
Kanab
Alpine

That's 16. Richfield I go back and forth on, it would be extremely helpful for cutting down driving distance but it would leave Manti basically destitute for stakes, especially with the others on my list. I'm sure there are others I'm not considering, too.

@Anonymous On the subject of Elder Groberg's prophecy of rivers dotting the Snake River Plain, we are certainly making progress. Burley was certainly a surprise to me but makes sense in context. I think in the next 10 years we will see additional temples in Caldwell and/or Nampa, Blackfoot, Ammon, and Rigby within the Snake River Plain, with additional Idaho temples in Coeur d'Alene and Preston. Maybe even Rexburg number 3 if their unprecedented growth continues.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

I'm guessing 18 will be announced this time, to bring the Temple Total to an even 300.

Since the field is so much more wide open now than in the past, I broke it down by region (like last time) and did about 3-7 possibilities
per.

My criteria for each region was about the same as six months ago - more or less that I choose 1 or 2 from my old picks (regardless of high likelihood), 1 or 2 new picks/dark horses, and 1 or 2 that I or Matt or another commenter felt was a fairly safe bet, not necessarily in that order.
(Several of these picks are the same from last time, as they weren't announced.)


Utah:

-Springville/Mapleton/Spanish Fork Area
-Price
-North Ogden/Pleasant View/Weber County 2nd
-Herriman
-Lehi/Eagle Mountain

Intermountain West/"LDS" Corridor USA:

-Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
-Rigby, Idaho
-Flagstaff, AZ
-Yuma, Arizona
-Las Vegas, Nevada, 2nd
-Kalispell or Great Falls, Montana

West Coast USA/Canada:

-Fairbanks, AK
-Tacoma, Washington
-Prince George or Victoria, British Columbia
-Lethbridge, Alberta
-Bakersfield, California

Central/South USA

-Rapid City, South Dakota
-El Paso, TX/Las Cruces, New Mexico
-Des Moines, Iowa
-Madison, Wisconsin
-Champaign or Bloomington, Illinois


Eastern USA

-Jackson, Mississippi
-Cincinnati, Ohio/Lexington, KY
-Dayton, Ohio
-Buena Vista, Virginia
-Charlotte, North Carolina
-Charleston, West Virginia

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

Mexico/Central America/Caribbean:

-Belize
-Cancún, MX
-Chihuahua, MX
-Acapulco, MX
-Trinidad or Jamaica
-Guyana
-Santa Ana, El Salvador

Brazil:

-João Pessao
-Foz do Iguaçu/Ciudad del Este, Paraguay (Triple Fronteira)
‐Florianopolis
-Ribeirão Preto/Natal
-Rio Branco

Rest of South America:

-Osorno, Chile/Viña del Mar
-Iquitos, Peru
-Lima, Peru #3
-Southern Patagonia: (Punta Arenas, Neuquén, etc.)
-Buenos Aires 2nd
-Maracaibo, Venezuela

Asia:

-Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
-Jakarta, Indonesia
-New Delhi, India or Pakistan
-Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia

Africa:

-Kampala, Uganda
-Cape Coast, Ghana
-Port Harcourt, Nigeria
-Abuja, Nigeria
-Luanda, Angola
-Cotonou, Benin/Lome, Togo
-Maputo, Mozambique

Australia/Oceania:

-Majuro, Marshall Islands
-Christchurch, New Zealand -Brisbane South, Australia
-Hobart, Australia
-Canberra, Australia

Philippines:

-Puerto Princesa
-Naga/Legazpi
-Angeles or Olongapo


Europe:

-Tirana, Albania
-Edinburgh, Scotland or Dublin, Ireland
-Porto, Portugal
-Germany #3

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

My list of 18 Predictions:
(Whittled down from my regional picks) + 3 Dark Horses

-Lehi/Eagle Mountain, UT
-Rigby, Idaho
-Flagstaff, AZ
-Lethbridge, Alberta
‐Florianopolis, Brazil
-Ribeirão Preto/Natal, Brazil
-Rio Branco, Brazil
-Osorno, Chile/Viña del Mar, Chile
-Southern Patagonia: (Punta Arenas, Neuquén, etc.)
-Buenos Aires 2nd
-New Delhi, India or Pakistan
-Port Harcourt, Nigeria
-Kampala, Uganda
-Cape Coast, Ghana
-Canberra, Australia
-Majuro, Marshall Islands
-Naga/Legazpi, Philippines
-Porto, Portugal

Dark Horses:
-Germany #3
-Guyana
-Buena Vista, Virginia

John Pack Lambert said...

I think the next temple announced in continental Europe will be in Germany, most likely Hamburg, but I could also see Munich. Prague is also a contender.

I think Bordeaux, France and Milan, Italy will also have temples announced in the not too distant future. Marseilles, Lyon or Geneva will probably get one as well. At some point Tirana will get one in south-east Europe. That would take in only one stake, and such temples are rarely announced. If Albania could get a second stake it would move up the list a lot.

Even with Stockholm doubling in size I think Goteborg will at some point get a temple.

I think at some point there will be a temple in Leeds, one in Scotland, one in Ireland, one in Bristol, and the Hyde Park Chapel will either be partly converted to a temple or have a temple built on top of it. I also think Berlin will some day get a temple. I would be surprised if all these come in the next 10 years, but predicting the future is hard.

John Pack Lambert said...

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is about to close its MTC in Colombia. With this move no area of the Church will have multiple MTCs. There will only be the Lima Peru MTC and the Mexico City Mexico MTC operating in Spanish-speaking nations.

I am wondering if the Colombia MTC in Bogota could become the site of a2nd temple in that city.

With the decision to rename the Rexburg Idaho Teton River Temple away from using a direciton, does this mean that we will get new names for the Sao Paulo Brazil East Temple and the Santiago Chile West Temple?

With Manila, Lima, Sao Paulo, Mexico City and Guatemala City outside the US, and Provo, South Jordan and Rexburg in the US having multiple temples announced, what do people expect to be the next multi-temple city?

I am guessing Buenos Aires, Argentina.

Mon Chou said...

I was reading a couple articles last night that the Church recently bought "Alder Castle" on Noble Street in London, which is a block from St. Paul's Cathedral and across the street from a section of the Roman remains of the London Walls. I'm not sure if this is one of thode investment properties (I think it might be since it has tenants such as Lloyd's Banks - a very prominent Bank in the UK), but this would be a nice location for a Temple too. (Very Manhattan style). But would it be too much of a statement being so close to the St. Paul Cathedral? It's literally in the shadows of St. Paul's. The Church spent $132 million on it.

Thoughts? Investment? Or future central London Temple?

John Pack Lambert said...

Well, investment property and temples are not mutually exclusive. Some of the total land The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints owns at the Manhattan Temple site, at least if you look at it as the total land the Church owns, is office building space leased to totally not related clients. Others parts of it is a chapel, the mission office, and I believe the public and government affairs office that Brother Ahmad Corbett used to run, before he became a mission president and then a high ranking person in the mission department (and 1st counselor in the general young men presidency).

The Church built a high rise apartment complex right next to the Philadelphia Temple. It built whole neighborhoods around the Payson and Kansas City Temples.

Just west of temple square the church just built a chapel with a huge office building on top of it, that I think it basically leases out.

Considering everything, I still suspect at this point Alder Castle is only meant to be an investment property. However it could evolve into something else. Keep in mind the Manhattan Temple property was purchased in the early 1970s. They built a multi-chapel church building on the site not long after it was purchased. The biggest logistical issue with building the Manhattan Temple is that doing so made it so fewer wards could meet at the building, so the Church had to find multiple other buildings in New York City at the same time.

Historia Familiar Valenzuela Escobar said...

There is very little left for the new general conference, and hopes for new temple announcements are rising.
I am always happy to see announcements of temples, moreover, if it is in places where the church was never thought to agree to build, having temples closer to home should encourage greater attendance and commitment.
I am Chilean, and despite the fact that we have many inactive people, we need more temples, since it is a long and distant country.
I hope they announce temples in Punta Arenas, Valdivia or Puerto Montt, Osorno, Viña del Mar and La Serena.
Perhaps the biggest problem is that there are not enough brothers to be workers, or few tithe payers.
The temples are a blessing and a challenge in the life of the baptized.

Mon Chou said...

I agree with you; the Alder Castle seems more of an investment property (for now) in my humblest of opinions for multiple factors:
1) Hyde Park has much more Church History tied to it with its proximity to Hyde Park & early missionary work. I think this is where a temple in central London would go. (But, of course, not for awhile).
2) I don't think the Church would intentionally be so brazen to put a temple a block from St. Paul's.
3) Alder Castle already has solid tenants and already set up nicely for long term investments.
4) Alder Castle was just reconstructed and modernized so I don't think the Church would tear it all down to reconstruct it for a Temple. I wouldn't be surprised if in the future (30 years from now or so), if they need a new Ward Building, however, if they use this building to fashion it for such.

Mon Chou said...

Although I'm from mainland Europe, the UK still holds a a special place in my heart as I did Graduate Studies in England for 3 years. I was pretty surprised to learn that the Church owned so much farmland in Cambridgeshire. A lot; the Church nearly owned as much, if not more, than the Crown in East Anglia, when I was there. But, as I said, that was for farmland. I don't think a temple will be there a long time, considering how few stakes are there.

Curious why Bristol is prioritized over Cardiff. Wales played a huge role in Church History; do you think Church History factors into decisions when it comes to location or more for accessibility conveniences? Yes, I know Bristol played a role too, but I see Cardiff as a symbol for the whole of Wales as a nation, ya know?

*With the recent name change of Birmingham, UK to Birmingham, England, I have more hope for little Wales (though not for awhile now that Birmingham has been called) and increased expectations for Scotland any day now.

Mon Chou said...

May I ask where you heard of the rumor for Ireland -- I'm hearing this one a lot in the rumor mill, and wondering where the source is. Also, does the source indicate where the location is?

I did read that the Church bought a small parcel in the North Pole (which I think might be the source of the Fairbanks rumor), but the article was vague and didn't give an address. It may have been the SLC preview (I don't have a subscription). I read this last night, I'll link it if I find it (but please anyone feel inclined to link it for me because I'm not sure if I'll find it again). I wonder if they would call it Fairbanks or North Pole?

Also, I'm not sure how long after acquiring land, the Church makes announcements? Do we have estimates?

Mon Chou said...

Bonjour Unknown, I'm curious about your Warsaw choice. I was also ruminating over this one because now that the Kiev Temple is not accessible. Since there are a lot of Ukrainian refugees in surrounding countries, would Warsaw be announced? I thought this. Is this, too, your lines of thinking?

Butterfly and Bones said...

@Whizzbang! Helllloop, my fellow Canuck!!

Prince George, BC is a great idea. I think I can get behind this. Are your thoughts that it would serve Grand Prairie, Alberta Stake and the Terrace, BC District too? Would they 3 serve one Temple district? All three of those areas are so desperately remote and Prince George is in the middle of them (Hwy 16 -- "HWY of tears" could now be transformed into a HWY of joy for those members). Do you know, if at the moment, do they all belong to the Edmonton Temple District?

Oh, but where would Juneau, AK fit into this if Prince George got a Temple? Juneau seems about halfway (but a little closer to Prince George) between Anchorage and Prince George. Would it stay in a Anchorage Temple District? Or be allotted to a Prince George Temple District? However, I'm not sure if it would matter that Juneau is technically a closer to Prince George because, from what I understand from the geography, you have to fly out regardless from Juneau (it's essentially an island because of the steep mountain range and coastlines), and I'm sure the flights are just automatically cheaper to Anchorage because it's all within the USA and seems like most tourists would continue in that direction, rather than towards Prince George.

Anyway, I like your thoughts on Prince George, Whizzbang. These northern Canucks are so remote and deal with such cruel winters. I'll promote this over my petty Victoria pick -- I guess all the rain makes me a little gloomy and jaded, but you're right; Prince George should get one first. haha. :)

But what are your thoughts on Vernon, BC. Those guys seem pretty distant, but they are just a lone stake. Cranbrook, BC too. These guys would be like a Winnipeg call. What do we think for our other eastern outliers in Sudbury, ON? or St. John, NB?


(sorry for all the non-Canadians not interested in this post)

Logan H said...
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Logan H said...
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Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

I can see Bogota eventually getting a 2nd Temple, though I'd be a bit surprised if it was right away.

It does have 22 Stakes and 7 Districts in its Temple District, but it's also pretty large, at 53,500 square feet.

9 of those districts are in Bogota itself.

The Bogota Temple was announced in 1984, but not completed until 1999.

Others of the 1980s/late 70s International Temples are now getting 2nd City Temples (like Sao Paulo), but some of them are much smaller (like Lima).

Sao Paolo has a similar amount of square footage, though it has 47 stakes (which will be divided with the new East Temple).

It will be interesting to see if they do end up turning that Colombian MTC into one (like JPL said), or if they announce one in Medellin or elsewhere to cut down the district and distance first.

Any Colombians here with more of a firsthand opinion? ;)

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@JPL:

I'm hoping for a second in Buenos Aires, as well.

Bryansb1984 said...

My guesses
Sandy, Utah
West Valley City, Utah
Mesa Arizona East
Bakersfield, California
Glasgow, Scotland
Osaka, Japan
Las Vegas Henderson or Summerlin
Baltimore, Maryland

Logan H said...
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Logan H said...
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Butterfly and Bones said...

@Bill Stranton, That's neat you heard rumors about a Blackfoot Temple! I was basing my honorable mention prediction pick off of the little cluster I saw on the map without a temple, between Pocatello and Idaho Falls. I hadn't heard about the prophecy about the Snake River Valley -- gorgeous -- thanks for passing that tid bit along.

@Jonathan Reese Whiting, do you think if the stars aligned and Kalispell were to get a temple, they would name it "Glacier?"

Curious if anyone has theories as to why they think the greater Seattle area hasn't had a 2nd temple announced? Are too many people leaving the Church or leaving the state of Washington? Or are the prices in the area too expensive? Or do you think they are deciding between Olympia, WA / Tacoma, WA? (of course we cannot speculate as to the things of the Lord, but if we were to put a logical explanation for us humans as to why). Also, who are we to say that one is not coming around the corner? Actually, has anyone heard of rumors?

*I'm always surprised by how many rumors actually churn up at this time of year! For instance, the Rigby & Blackfoot one! The Fairbank & Ireland one, too. What else is out there?

Logan H said...

300 would be wonderful, so here’s 18…

Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
Osaka, Japan
Naga / Legazpi, Philippines
Santiago / Tuguegarao / Ilagan, Philippines

Bakersfield OR San Jose, California
Charlotte, North Carolina
Colorado Springs, Colorado
El Paso, Texas
Flagstaff, Arizona
Fairbanks, Alaska OR Kahului, Hawaii
Lehi / Herriman, Utah
Spanish Fork / Price, Utah
Tacoma, Washington

Chiclayo OR Iquitos, Peru
Florianópolis / São José OR Riberao Preto, Brazil
Rosario, Argentina

Scotland OR Germany
Kampala, Uganda

IF 18 announced with 2 in Utah there would be 300 with 30 in Utah. Utah would have 10% exactly

Logan H said...

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1u43FCPw6aIUYERUNO597UgVBfl12bT5I&usp=sharing

Map showing distance/time from temples.
Adapted from Matt’s map, it shows a 200 mile buffer (orange) and 3 hour buffer (red) around temple locations.
It has some glitches and is missing a few, but is fun to look at.

Kimberley in San Diego said...

I'm finding this speculation on where the new temples will be built to be fascinating. But I'm confused by some of it. To me, it seems like a temple in Mongolia would have 10 times the value of another temple in Utah because it would mean bringing temple blessings into the lives of members who never would have the chance to go to the temple otherwise, as opposed to a temple that just makes attendance slightly more convenient.

The Yorba Linda temple is being built just 25 miles from Huntington Beach temple in spite of temple attendance decreasing in Southern California. At the San Diego Temple sometimes sessions will only have one patron in attendance. Wouldn't it make more sense to use the church funds to build temples where there is a greater need? Matt suggested that this may be occurring because our leaders are getting inspiration about where the future needs are in ways that are not apparent to me. I'm hoping it means that California is posed at the return of a growth spurt in membership after a decade of decline.

Christopher Duerig said...

Good News coming from the war torn country of Ukraine. In the eastern Poltava Region (Oblast), in the Administrative Center of Poltava, the "Poltava Branch - 366846" of the "Kharkiv Ukraine Stake - 616907", was recently reorganized as the "Poltava Ward - 366846".

87 Sep 17, 2022 Poltava Ward Poltava, Ukraine

https://classic.churchofjesuschrist.org/maps/#ll=49.496803,34.964383&z=8&m=google.hybrid&layers=stakecenter&q=616907&find=stake:616907

Gary said...

A 5th Stake was created in the Charlotte metro area today. The new stake is the Lake Norman North Carolina Stake.If Charlutte was chosen to have a Temple the district would include at least 9 stakes.

Zach said...

I imagine Bloomington is favorable because it's central to Peoria, Champaign, and Springfield.

Whizzbang said...

@Butterfly and Bones- I would imagine that the Juneau Stake would still be attached to the Anchorage temple for the reasons you listed, cost and no passports being the top of the list. I'd say the Grande Prairie Stake, Prince George Stake and the Terrace District would go to the PG for the temple. Like the temple here, it may not be open a lot due to the distance and cost and whatnot but certainly it's easier to travel to PG than it is to Edmonton or Vancouver. I don't imagine Vernon getting one. I wouldn't know what other stakes, other than Cranbrook, could attend the Vernon Temple if they did. It's just easier to attend Vanc. or Cardston. I think the pull from the east would be if they built one in Lethbridge and then Vernon would be out and vice versa and so I think they'd leave things as is. I would be extremely surprised if Sudbury got one as the Toronto Temple is hardly used now, I think another Ontario temple would further strain things, granted too the Toronto Temple is not even in Toronto and it isn't easy to get to. Same with the East Coast, I know distance is an issue but I think it would almost make the Halifax Temple obsolete. Winnipeg has two stakes attend here and so the Regina Temple lost those and so they only have the two Sask. Stakes going but a lot of Saskatooners go to Cardston so I don't know how many people really attend Regina.

Butterfly and Bones said...

@Gary! What a nice announcement. Yup, guys! I feel it in my bones. Charlotte, NC will finally get it's moment in the sun this GC!

Butterfly and Bones said...

Anyone else notice Belfast, N. Ireland featured this morning in "Music & the Spoken Word"? Does the leadership drop Easter Eggs/hints a la Taylor Swift?

Daniel said...

I favor selfish Champaign for personal reasons if there’s gonna be a temple in Central Illinois. Bloomington is more centralized for the Peoria stakes (mostly for the members out in Galesburg or Kewanee), but for the Springfield and Champaign stakes, Decatur would be more centralized. Champaign might be a good choice geographically, though, since it would be accessible via one Interstate highway to most members of all three stakes. Plus, the strong university in Champaign means that a decent number of western members attend school there (some unmarried undergraduates but more married graduate students) which would provide a good base of temple workers and would strengthen the appeal of the university for members looking for engineering or business degrees (both specialties of the university, which is the most prominent university in downstate Illinois). Bloomington does seem like a location that’s more focused on convenience for the Peoria Illinois Stake than for the other two and is some distance away from the nearest stake center and can’t really draw on some of the locational strengths a Peoria, Springfield, or Champaign location might be able to provide (Illinois State University is a much smaller school than the University of Illinois, and the Champaign Illinois Stake has the soul YSA unit in the region). Additionally, the church has favored temples located near stake centers, especially for smaller temples, which would lend support for a Peoria, Champaign, or Springfield location. (And a Peoria or Springfield location would be further than Indianapolis for most of the Champaign Illinois Stake.)

One interesting aspect that might favor a temple in the region is that the Champaign Illinois Stake is part of the North America Central Area of the church while Indianapolis, with the temple, is in the North America Northeast Area, and Champaign is in the Missouri St Louis Mission instead of the Indiana Indianapolis Mission. Missionaries in the stake need permission to leave the area to attend convert ordinances in the temple and have to travel to St Louis for when they attend the temple. (On the topic of mission boundaries, the Peoria Stake is in the Iowa Des Moines Mission and has been since the Illinois Peoria Mission was closed back in the 2000s or 2010s, so that would still be an issue for them with a Central Illinois temple. For what it’s worth, the Illinois Nauvoo Mission exclusively covers historic Nauvoo and Carthage Jail.)

Daniel said...

Dallas is also a heavily used temple (though I’m sure Las Vegas is, too). Granted, it was during the Oklahoma City renovation, but there were hour long waits for initiatories on Saturdays in 2018. And Fort Worth is probably at least a 90 minute drive from the temple, since Arlington is about a 60 minute drive (and is also in Tarrant County, like Fort Worth).

For what it’s worth, temple worship seems to be becoming a more important part of our religious life (especially outside of Utah, where convenient access to temples made it easy to make a regular habit of attending the temple). I never saw a temple until I was 12 and went to do baptisms for the first time, and I don’t remember many members from my ward or stake frequently attending the temple. But during the DC and Raleigh temple closures, every weekend saw people coming up from the DC area to Philadelphia on charter buses, and Dallas had plenty of people making the trip from the Oklahoma City area. I’m sure that the increased accessibility of temples has driven an increase in the quantity of ordinances done, and that increase in ordinances performed is driving the increase of the availability of temples.

Daniel said...

For most likely, I suspect Victoria or another southern Albertan temple. I think Ottawa is a possibility (but perhaps a smaller one), but I’d love to see another temple in Maritime or Atlantic Canada (maybe Mocton or St John’s).

Daniel said...

As far as the Intermountain West goes, I see Rigby and Blackfoot as pretty strong options for a Snake River temple. I was thinking Malad City instead of Preston for a smaller extreme southeast Idaho temple. Mountain Home splits the difference between Twin Falls and Boise. I felt like Coeur d’Alene was too close to Spokane, but since I’ve found out that it’s operating at capacity, Spokane makes more sense.

John said...

I've said this before, maybe not here, but while members have been leaving California, there are still plenty of them left. And those who are staying will have children, and I don't think they will all go off to one of the BYUs and not come back, or anything like that. I see Yorba Linda as a good counter-balance to Newport Beach for Orange County. And the Brethren may be looking at traffic times for all we know.

Mon Chou said...

The fact that you apologize at the end of your post makes me smile. It's such a Canadian stereotype to be "sorry." :) All in good fun!

I would like to add Saskatoon to your list of Canadian "lone wolf" stakes that want to be closer to a temple. I believe you Lumberjacks, specifically Whizzbang, have discussed this in times past (maybe maybe that's why it was left off the list - intentional?), and the consensus was that it would take too much individuals from Regina, and both temples then would would struggle to staff a temple? Is that my understanding from both of you?

How does Bismark, North Dakota manage?

Any anecdotal stories how Winnipeg is holding up with just 2 stakes?

Eduardo Serna said...

Only for Mexico area:

Juchitan, Oaxaca
Acapulco, Guerrero
Cuahutla, Morelos
Cancun, Quintana Roo
Chihuahua, Chihuahua

Best Regard.

Mon Chou said...

Wow; I wasn't expecting ANY news concerning Ukrainian units. Why do we think a branch was upgraded to a ward - I wouldn't expect that at all. (Unless it's members opening up their homes to other member families/friends that are refugees, in which case other Ukrainian units will permanently be smaller - unless they're new members). I have no idea - so I will not think out loud, and will just be grateful for now! Thank you for sharing!!

I know it's still very much a "fluid" situation in Ukraine, but do we know (by where the Church records went), how many Ukrainian members went to which various countries (e.g., Poland, Hungary, Austria, Albania, England, USA, Canada, etc .)

Mon Chou said...

I'm simply puzzled, but intrigued as you're not the only one that I've seen (in the last few years), who has listed Pakistan on a longer list of future predicted temples. Did I miss something? Why has this become a possibility? Why am I seeing it every now and then hidden on lists? (I was a little shocked with UAE, but I get it now -- they invited us!! but my jaw would hit the floor if Pakistan was announced soon).

Is the reasoning such that technically we have the green light from the government so while we are on good terms, we should do it? And it would essentially serve the US expats?

Fill me in on the scoop.

Matt said...

Mon Chou - There are more than 5,000 Latter-day Saints in Pakistan - essentially all of whom are native Pakistanis. The Church organized a separate mission for Pakistan in 2021 where only Pakistani missionaries serve. However, things still seem a ways off before we get stakes in Pakistan, and the security situation for Christians there is a concern for whether a temple will be safe or not.

Whizzbang said...

There is no way on earth that Saskatoon would get a temple anytime soon, given that Regina has a temple. Unless loads of members move to Saskatoon or something it won't happen. Winnipeg is doing fine, there are two stakes with members in Warroad, MN and a part of North Dakota that support the temple. There would be one very small stake per temple in Sask. and it just wouldn't happen. I honestly would be surprised if Canada got another one anytime soon. I think Bismarck is doing fine as far as I know

Anonymous said...

@Kimberly: Thanks for your thoughts. I think another thing to consider when comparing Mongolia vs another Utah temple, is the value of the dead being liberated on the other side of the veil in preparation for the 2nd coming. A massive number of temple ordinances are being done in UT for the dead. :-)

Daniel Moretti said...

I would like to inform you that my suggestions are in a previous post. I tried to bring them here but Matt understood that additional registration was not necessary. But there's something that's been puzzling me about the announcements in remote areas or areas with few stakes: Is it possible that the Church will start shortening opening hours in some lesser-used temples? Could these switch to operating only on Saturdays and one or two nights a week?

Pascal Friedmann said...

Yes, I believe this makes a lot of sense. Think of it this way. You can run the whole week with a small number of workers if you set up four weekly shifts of four hours each and open the temple from Thursday thru Saturday.

Thursday and Friday night, run two endowment sessions and while those sessions are active, you can draw some ordinance workers over to helping with initiatories and sealings. If you open the baptism for groups only, you just need one worker to coordinate. Saturday, you can do the same thing, just with two shifts, so you run a total of 8 endowment sessions and just as many initiatory and sealing sessions each week.

Four shifts with 10-15 workers each means you need 40 to 60 temple workers to be there every week. If you have a good number of local units nearby, that is absolutely feasible.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@Mon Chou

Thanks for reminding me of the Cardiff prospect. I'll add it to my regional list since my Europe prospects had gotten a little thin.

Speaking of early missionary work, Dan Jones was Welsh or of Welsh descent. I seem to recall a talk I heard back in the day where President Hinckley considered him one of the greatest missionaries of our dispensation, because of how many converts he had in the British Isles.

I'm of Welsh descent myself (John Reese is a common name over in Wales, though they spell it "Rhys").

Unknown said...

I'm guessing the total temples (announced, operating, or under construction) will sail past, but not too far past 300. My reasoning is that they won't want to just miss the 300 mark; so they'll be working to get a larger group locked in enough for a public announcement. And, when they get 2-4 more than they needed all ready to go, they will still announce them instead of leaving any out that have been prepared. It should be that more focus is placed on moving along the individual sites than on hitting a round total number.

Just want to drop a note here that there are more reasons for building temples than a small list: personal and proxy temple work. Temples are meant to act as a defense at some point more literally than now. Temples are built for healing in an area in need of healing. Reading the dedication prayers you'll see many reasons for, or effects of, or uses for temples. This is just to say; it's okay that you miss a lot of the reason behind the order temples are announced. You can't see everything in data.

John Pack Lambert said...

Dallas is half the size of Las Vegas Temple. Of course Fort Worth is getting a temple, so the brethren have acknowledged that Dallas is used above ideal capacity and are adding another temple.

I think the next temple announced for Texas will be El Paso, and that would not surprise me.

Someone pointed out that if 18 more temples are announced and 2 are in Utah, that would put 10% of temples in Utah. I believe the percentage of church members in Utah is higher than that. around 600 or the 3500 stakes are in Utah, so that puts the percentage of stakes in Utah, at almost 20%. On the other hand, since Utah has some very large temples, It might be more useful to crunch the numbers of total square footage in Utah temples as opposed to elsewhere. Although there are a huge number of reasons why square footage in temples is not 100% comparable.

There are lots of complex issues involved in these decisions.

miro said...

@Christopher Duerig
Poltava Branch did not recently become a ward. It happend over a year ago when the Kharkiv became a stake. It just recnelty shoed up as a ward on the Meetinghouse locator and in CDOL but when you check in CDOL when the Bishop was called you can notice it was on the same day the stake got organized on 25 Apr 2021.

Nephi said...

The branch in the Ukraine that was upgraded to a Ward did not happen this year. The branch was upgraded in 2021 when the district was made into a Stake. I'm not sure why it took the church so long to update that in their records.

Pills & Pillows said...

I second what John stated about California temples/California membership data. The Lord is not looking at the present, but much further in the future. The Saints in California will have children, and hopefully there will be growth by way of missionary work too. The Church will continue to grow or sustain itself with immigration, but the amount of property left in California will only become more scarce (as is the case everywhere). You can't grow more land. The Lord has a vision 50 years beyond ours - to infinity and beyond.

I really just wanted to ask what people thought of Vacaville, California being a Temple possibility? Halfway to Sacramento & Oakland? In the Solano County/Napa Valley region. (I know San Jose would come before it)

When President Hinckley was Prophet, President Erying came to our Stake Conference (I was 12) and stated that the First Presidency would remember our righteousness in the future, and that particularly the Youth of Vacaville, would be remembered as a light on a hill or something to that effect -- and when missions applications came to the first presidencies from Vacaville, they would know they're sending out their best. None of what Erying said has anything to do with Temples -- I just maintained a love for Vacaville. A temple in the golden hills would be nice, and it's not like Oakland and Sacramento are exactly close. Traffic is nuts in California.

Adam said...

A new ward was created in the Bentonville Arkansas State. The Gravette Ward was formed with members from the Centerton 1st Ward and Bella Vista Ward. The 5 northernmost chapels in Northwest Arkansas all have four wards meeting in the chapels each Sunday, so with Gravette there will be one with five. The stake presidency also announced plans to build a second chapel in Centerton.

Still no word on the Bentonville temple completion date, though carpets and chandeliers are being installed this week.

Mon Chou said...

Makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.

Mon Chou said...

Wow! Incredible. Thanks for taking the time to inform me on that. Did the native Pakistani members join the Church elsewhere and bring it home to Pakistan? Fascinating.

Do we know how members are faring amid the catastrophic floods?

Butterfly and Bones said...

I, for one, did not see this coming!

Heber Valley Temple is going to be one hefty temple!! It's a 88,000 sqr ft temple for that little valley! Utah is going to be one busy bee apparently. The construction team better skip to it!!

I learned over the weekend that Salt Lake City is in the bids (between Vancouver & Sapporo) for the 2030 Winter Olympics. If they do not win the bid (which I heard might be the case because the USA will be hosting the 2028 Summer Olympics in Los Angeles), Salt Lake City will place a bid again for 2034. The Olympics would certainly bring a lot of folks to the "best snow on earth" and their temple studded valleys? I can't figure out why Heber is so massive? Thoughts?

And, whoa buddy, did you see the size of the Teton Temple? I'll let someone else broach that topic.

anonymous said...

Lets look at the Halifax Nova Scotia Temple. Has to be one of the most sparsely member populated temple districts in North America.

The Halifax temple is not open on Tuesdays. On Wednesdays it is open in the morning for one Endowment session and Initiatory. On Thursdays it is open in the evening for one Endowment session and Initiatory. On Fridays, the temple is only open for Baptisms and Sealings in the evening (no other ordinances). Saturdays, the temple is open mid day for Sealings, one Endowment session and Initiatory.

Members from Fredericton, NB would have to travel 265 miles one way to attend. 240 miles for members in Sydney, NS. Members from Charlottetown, PEI would travel 200 miles one way.

I do not know how many temple workers would be required to staff each shift; maybe 10-12??

I could see similar schedules being utilized in Ottawa, Victoria or Saskatoon.

EP said...

Teton River Rexburg Idaho Temple with 130,000 square feet makes it the biggest temple the Church has built in 40 years and likely the 6th biggest in the Church. No one in Rexburg saw this coming, the initial presentation was made with Orem's design as a stand-in. It's more than double the size of the existing Rexburg temple. Might we be looking at something like a 6 endowment/12 sealing/2 baptistry design? I'm surprised that it's just this big. In the modern temple building era, I think it could safely be said that Teton River's size is unprecedented.

anonymous said...

I currently work as an Ordinance Worker at a temple in the BOM Belt, but not in Utah (and not a 90k sq ft temple). Our temple is open Tuesday through Saturday. Tuesday through Thursday, the temple is open for shifts in both the morning and the evenings (but not the afternoon). Four Endowment sessions each shift (64 Seats). All other ordinances available. Friday and Saturdays, the temple is open all day (three shifts). There are eleven Endowment sessions each day and all other ordinances are available. We have two Sealers assigned to every shift. We have 36 brothers and 36 sisters per shift. A lot of workers, work more than one shift during the week. The Baptistry is full all evenings and Saturdays. Endowment sessions full Friday and Saturday evenings. Sealings and Initiatory are up and down during the week, especially weekdays.

Some workers on my shift drive 100 to 120 miles to serve.

Most drive 5-30 miles.

Pascal Friedmann said...

I know that the The Hague Netherlands temple at least used to operate with four (!) workers plus the temple presidency, except on Saturday when there were maybe a dozen. This is on the extreme lower end though and puts significant limitations on operation. Four is the absolute minimum number you can have to run an endowment session, but that means if you have four workers only, you can't even man the recommend desk. And you don't - typically, the doors would only open for about 20 minutes before each session and then be locked from the inside.

Noah said...

130,000 Sq feet is about the size of the Provo Temple. I think the reconstructed Temple's rendering may be very similar to the Teton River Temple's design.

Jim Anderson said...

30k id more like it for Teton River. Adding that extra digit likely a typo, should be simlar to the one down the street (and this may be that two temples are on the same road in the same close geographic area.

They are expecting major growth if they are going to build as big as Syracuse in Heber City. I didn't seem to see any information about two baptistries, but it looks like a similar interior floor plan to Lindon and Syracuse.

Saw the note about some CA temples having very few attending, was that during the day? If so, that would be common with most temples. Provo I would go, and there would be as few as 7 in one of the 84 seat rooms.

I think Provi City Center does better, usually a third full most sessions, the larger room upstairs can hold 96 and the two ground floor rooms (two-stage endowment) hold less than that or about 90.

James said...

Jim Anderson, it's not a typo. The site in question is at least 5-10 acres larger than most sites identified for temples. I'm no expert on building construction, but the expensive acreage seems more than substantial enough to accommodate a temple 100,000 square feet larger than we've recently seen. I addressed the question of the size in my analysis of this announcement on my blog:

https://stokessoundsoff.blogspot.com/2022/09/breaking-temple-news-site-location.html

James said...

I meant to say "expansive", not "expensive". Sorry. Autocorrect strikes again!

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@Butterfly and Bones

"Glacier" would be an interesting name, to tie the name of the temple to mountain peaks, as they have with others.

However, I would hope they go with "Kalispell," in honor of the Salish.

Or I suppose they could call it the "Flathead Lake" Temple, to go with the water theme as they have with others.

As far as Seattle goes, I know several members/have heard of several more who have left the area due to crime rate, inflation, politics, population, etc.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@Christopher Duerig & Mon Chou

I'm curious to find out more details about the Ukrainian Ward update as well, if and when they come to light.

J S A said...

Lake Norman North Carolina Stake (2204819)
Active Date: 18 Sep 2022
Cornelius Ward (2056860)
Huntersville Ward (496820)
Lake Norman Ward (184330)
Mooresville Ward (1940430)
Mountain Island Ward (357014)
Statesville Ward (47570)

John Pack Lambert said...

Interesting development with both Heber Valley Utah and Teton River Idaho Temples.

Heber Valley is a growing area. Beyond that the temple will cover Park City and the rest of Summit County.

The current number of stakes in that area does not actually capture the number of people who regularly go to this area for vacation. I believe that President Nelson and his family have a vacation home in that general area, but more to he point lots and lots and lots of people do. Creating a set up so people can easily go and do temple work as part of their family vacation is one of the parts of President Nelson's vision of making the temple a more integral part of Church member's lives. Building temples so that they are accesible to the people is not the same as building temples so they are next to people's official addresses.

This is a key part of temple function. Unlike regular church attendance on Sunday people have broad latitude in which temple they chose to go to as patrons, although generally less on which temple they are temple workers at.

So this means that you build temples in areas not just where people live, but where they vacation, and when you build them where they vacation you consider population during vacation times.

Temples are built based on use, not based on where members have records. For similar reasons the Nauvoo Temple really does not impact the potential for a temple in either Des Moines or Champaign much. I suspect that vacationers may also play a role in the placement of the Montpelier Idaho Temple, and while I am less hopeful Buffalo New York will get a temple soon, and Rochester New York will not get one for even longer, Utica or somewhere else in that general region of New York may get a temple very soon.

I am a bit surprised that Teton River is over 100,000 square feet. Very few temples have been built above 100,000 square feet.

Although as a temple worker in the Detroit Temple, especially one who only recently started, I do feel that the temple lacks enough space for us new workers to study and be trained. So I say more space in temples is always good.

On the issue of temples being remodeled. Most of the Hinckleyan temples that have been remodeled have expanded a bit. A few that have not gone through closure are bigger than their listed size. Detroit Temple they enclosed the entrance way that used to just be an outside space with an awning over it.

Most of the increases in size have been under 1000 sqare feet, and a few under 200 square feet. However the increase in size for the Raleigh North Carolina Temple was about 2000 square feet, which is not all that small when the temple itself was 10,700 to start.

Lai'e started at 10,500 and is now at 44,000. It would be interesting to see how total temple area has changed over time.

Jim Anderson said...

The Detroit Temple is on a three-acre leftover from when the stake center it sits by was built. Those who have its dedication program from 1960 say it was called the 'Detroit Tabernacle' in that. So some thought it was a temple that were not members who say that, which also may have led to confusion when the smaller temple was built alongside it.

Have heard stories also of inadequate dressing room space, so some would change then cross the parking lot to the entrance. Not sure if that may still be happening.

John Pack Lambert said...

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints owns a total of 8 acres at the site where the Detroit Temple is. The stake center was intentionally built on one corner of the lot to make it so the remaining lot could be sold. It was also not originally built as a stake center. The stake center then was on Sorrento, just south of Schoolcraft or more exactly almost next to Davison St. Davison is a freeway further east, but at Sorento is a residential street, smaller than Schoolcraft, which is also known at least in some people's minds as 4 Mile. The mile roads are placed a mile apart and are generally major roads, although 5 Mile is the lowest number that has any signage for such. The old stake center was torn down when the I-96 freeway was built, but they did move the preparation panels for the Relief Society monument, which were in that building because Avard Fairbanks was a member of the Detroit branch when he designed that monument, to the Bloomfield Hills chapel which because the new stake center. The Bloomfield Hills Chapel is just a little north of what would be 16 mile, and less than 3 miles further west of Sorento. The Bloomfield Hills building was expanded when it was made the stake center.

The Bloomfield Hills stake center is both larger in total area and taller than the adjacent temple.

You really cannot do changing for the temple outside the temple. There is adequate changing space in the Detroit Temple, although they may have created a little more in the totally done by endowed workers remodel for four months in 2021. I would imagine that anyone using the stake center to change would be doing so because they were wearing clothing that they would not feel comfortable in the temple at all in. I am not sure I have ever seen a chapel with as large changing space as the Bloomfield Hills Stake Center.

I am really hoping to see a temple announced for Grand Rapids this fall.

Jim Anderson said...

Just learned that it took a year to design Heber Valley, I know the architect's wife who does case work for Medicaid and other medical assistance for low income and disabled here in Utah. That kind of time needed is a given for the larger temples, so that is why it may be taking a little longer to get Teton River going, and why no announcement for another big one in Utah, it goes without saying the temple department has its hands full with all that have been announced anyway, so they may have wanted to wait until they had personnel available to properly work on the plans for more.

Mon Chou said...

Would you say this may factor into why some areas in Europe have temples announced?

Jim Anderson said...

Yesm so they can assign an architect or two to work on it as soon as they become available. Also smaller temples afre less complex for the drawings that have to be made. Provo City Center had 800 pages of plans and drawings according to one I know who was at the planning department for a different matter, and those were sitting on the counter.


How they decide what may be another matter, may depend on other outside factors outside of the design process. Governments, other entities may need certain things to go into a design in terms of things we may not ever see in the finished temple. Building codes, other concerns are clearly a part of it.

Unknown said...

One of the architects who works on temples is in my ward. I was asking him a bit about the design process a few weeks back. Apparently, changes to the plans even after construction begins are not uncommon, and while this occurs on many large projects, he made it sound like the church tends to make more significant changes, and more numerous changes, to their requirements even after a "final" design is in place and construction underway, which makes temples a more time consuming and difficult project for the architects than other similar-sized projects. I imagine this impacts how quickly they can get new projects off the ground (or, alternatively, requires more architects than would otherwise be required).

--Felix

Whizzbang said...

The Winnipeg Temple was originally designed without a coat room, which is fine if you live in a hot climate but doesn't work for Canada. So, they had the groundbreaking in Dec. 2016 and then didn't actually start construction until June 2018 because they had to do some redesigning to work in the coat room.

Eduardo said...

Some may think that Baltimore might get a temple, but I can think of a few reasons why they would not.
1. The DC temple is on the north side of the Metro Beltway, in Montgomery County, Maryland. A relatively easy drive for most people in Baltimore.
2. For those who live north of Baltimore, they are within 1-2 hours from the Philadelphia Temple.
3. There are people (many stakes) who live in Delaware, Maryland, and Virginia east, south, and west of DC that are over an hour drive away from the DC Temple. Again, Baltimoreans can drive that in not too much time, same distance as all these other Washington D.C. temple goers. And in many cases their traffic is worse than coming down from Baltimore, which has two freeways that connect to the Metroplex beltway.

I think that the East Coast would be better served by having temples in West Virginia, Maine or further to the west in New Hampshire or Vermont. I could envision a temple in Sharon, for sure. It would be a destination for many. I heard that the Palmyra Temple does really well with ordinances. I bet Sharon VT would do well, too.

I am not trying to throw shade on Baltimore, it is a neat place. I just don't see a temple being convenient there for a long time. If I am wrong, great for them and everyone else.

Anonymous said...

With the announcement that the Teton River Temple in Rexburg will be about 130,000 sq. ft., I’m starting to think the rumored MTC for Rexburg may be announced in 2-3 yrs. I see several key similarities between Provo and Rexburg (by comparing the cities now and by comparing Provo pre-MTC to Rexburg now. I’m guessing a Rexburg MTC would initially train missionaries living in the US & Canada who will speak english (and maybe spanish) on their missions.

Eric S. said...

I'm a bit late this time, but here are my 20 picks. I too can potentially see 18 being announced so that we reach the 300 total number, but I'm always happy with however many and seeing where new ones are announced. In no particular order:

1. Ulaanbaatar Mongolia
2. Busan Korea
3. Naga Philippines
4. Savaii Samoa
5. Devonport or Hobart Australia
6. Kampala Uganda
7. Abuja Nigeria
8. Glasgow Scotland
9. Hamburg Germany
10. Punta Arenas Chile
11. São José/Florianópolis Brazil
12. Iquitos Perú
13. Santa Ana El Salvador
14. Cancún México
15. Charlotte North Carolina
16. Milwaukee Wisconsin
17. Rapid City South Dakota
18. Colorado Springs Colorado
19. Coeur d'Alene Idaho
20. Fairbanks Alaska

If the next Utah temple is announced, I'm going to guess Herriman this time. I go back and forth between this and Spanish Fork.

Mon Chou said...

Would you mind giving an example or excerpt from a dedicatory prayer.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@EP & Noah:

I wonder if they're going to make The Teton River and Provo Reconstruction like sister temples in size and design (kind of like how Provo and Orem used to be), because they'll both be in two the Church's main University Towns?

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@John Pack Lambert:

My bro-in-law would be happy if Utica were announced. (He served his mission there.)

I'm curious as to your math for why the Utica area will get one soon?

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@Cory Ward

If you happen to be reading, I was wondering if you made a Temple Bracket for the upcoming Conference that we could all download and share? :)

John Pack Lambert said...

Looking at the map of where stakes are, Utica New York might not get a temple anytime soon. However if we really are looking at averaging about 4 stakes per temple of under 11,000 square feet where long distances are involved, Utica would take in probably 4 stakes and 1 district. It might depend on where temples in Northern New England are placed though. I think at least 1 northern New England temple will be announced before another is announced for New York State, and I could see Scranton or somewhere by there getting a temple. I could also see the Priesthood Restoration Site getting a temple.

The vision of a temple going people means we all have to step-up more. This was made easier a few years ago when they removed a lot of the past rules on who could be temple workers, making it so mothers of children under 18 can now be temple workers, members of bishoprics and some other rules. Basically now anyone who is a worthy temple recommend holder can in theory be a temple worker, although there may be a higher bar for the spiritual maturity needed for temple workers, but it is not set out by any specific rules, it is determined on a case by case basis. The wording on this change did emphasize that people should not over extend themselves, so there are probably some people in the past blocked out groups who would not be in a situation to be temple workers, but the old rules excluded a lot of people who really did have the time.

At the Detroit Temple they only asked me to commit to work 2 about 4 hour shifts a month. I eventually decided to do every Saturday, from roughly 8:30 (when we start prayer meeting) to 1:00 PM. However most only do every other Saturday, and a few do Friday night and Saturday once a month.

Detroit Temple is open on Tuesday Evening, Wednesday evening (1 endowment session each), Thurday 10 and 12, Thurday 7:00 PM, Firday 10, 12, 6:30 PM and 8:00 PM, and Saturday 9:30, 11:00, and I believe 2 afternoon sessions. The baptistry is basically open at all those times. Initiatory and sealings are also done, but maybe not both all the time.

Mon Chou said...

I read this (link below) about Praia Cape Verde Temple and it made me think of your comment regarding temples' purposes and "healing" being one of them. I think you meant healing in terms of people and individuals/cultures/nations, but this reminded me that the actual land/earth itself needs to be healed too. And it makes sense that the temple benefits the earth too -- because in the original temple -- on the Day of the Atonement (Yom Kippur -- the atonement rituals covered the individuals, nation, and the land. It purified and healed it all.

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders/2022/9/20/23354005/miracle-of-the-rain-continues-praia-cape-verde-temple-dedication-elder-andersen

Mon Chou said...

I also just wanted to clarify, that I'm not challenging you on your temples for "defense" in the future comment. I just wanted you to elaborate because I was interested in where you were going with that thought and wanted to generate a discussion. I just liked where you were going with the discussion, that's all. :) I wanted to read more about what you were saying... I wasn't skeptical. If that makes sense? (Sometimes it's hard for sentiments to come across).

Yamil Inosotroza said...

Regarding Chile, I'm not very optimistic about a temple in Osorno. Puerto Montt is a more likely option to me. I think future temples in Chile would be in Greater Valparaiso, Punta Arenas, and La Serena. Another temple to serve Church members in Arica would be built in Tacna, Perú, where there are more stakes organized.

L. Chris Jones said...

What about a temple in Piura Peru. Or a central Idaho stake (Likey in Moore) that can cover Moore, Carey, Salmon and maybe Terreton stakes? What about temples in Bahrain or Batawana or Angola as dark horse? .

L. Chris Jones said...

Soon hope to see either Punto Arenas or Tierra del Fuego as the most southern temple. Or Temples in Albania, New Caledonia, Indonesia, Mongolia, Micronesia, Marshall Islands, and many others.

steve_j said...

The church hires architecture firms to design temples. The church doesn’t do that in-house anymore - they haven’t for decades.

John Pack Lambert said...

I knew the person who was the designated person on his firm who did the initial design of the Philadelphia Temple. His father was my bishop for several years. However later on The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints contracted with another firm to provide a design.

There are parts of the design process that are controlled internally by the Church in various internal departments.

Cory said...

Yes, Here is the Temple Bracket for this conference:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1lyP-MfolBEtmqbFqCD70xtZs1br4_-Mu/view?usp=sharing

I'll add my top 10:

Charlotte North Carolina
Tacoma Washington
Lehi Utah
Colorado Springs Colorado
Santa Ana El Salvador
Chiclayo Peru
Santiago Dominican Republic
Florianopolis Brazil
Naga Philippines
Uyo Nigeria

And since a lot of people are going to 18, here are 8 more:

Fairbanks Alaska
Coeur d'Alene Idaho
Cancun Mexico
Rivera Uruguay
Buenos Aires North
Kampala Uganda
Dublin Ireland
Papara Tahiti


I did notice on the classic maps (Which they are now saying will go away on October 15th) that the Chile Osorno Mission is the Chile Puerto Montt mission. I am thinking that they moved the mission headquarters down there to be closer to the El Tepual Airport, which has flights that go to Punta Arenas. This probably helps the mission president and missionaries travel down there. I don't know if this means anything for the prospect of a temple within the mission boundaries.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@John Pack Lambert

Thanks for the extra info on the Utica prospects!

Though I'd be happy for my brother-in-law if they built one there, I really wouldn't mind if they built one in Sharon, Vermont, or the Priesthood Restoration Site in Pennsylvania, first.

Perhaps a possible name for that one could be the "Susquehanna River" Temple?

Nancy said...

JRW, I love the idea of a 'Susquehanna River' Temple. Such a beautiful name, and a beautiful event that the temple would honor and commemorate. I wonder if the population could keep it open.

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

Thanks, Cory!

Johnathan Reese Whiting said...

@Nancy

I hope so. It'd be interesting to see if it happens. :)

Historia Familiar Valenzuela Escobar said...

Announcements of temples are always cause for joy, especially in places that would not have happened decades before.
There is money in the church and much work to be done in the temples, and much work to be done in the family history centers.
I long for several announcements not only for my country Chile, but also, in many places where they are required

John Pack Lambert said...

The Wikipedia article on Harry Percival Vete has been nominated for Proposed deletion. The article states that Vete was a member of the Tongan Legislative Assembly. This is clearly grounds to keep any articles, and it should at least go to AfD. I would remove the Proposed deletion tag, but since the "religious figures" editing ban on me has been said to be "broadly construed" I know someone will attack me for this, even though the article does not really present Vete as having been a religious figure.

John Pack Lambert said...

Vete and his wife made a trip to I believe Idaho to go to the temple in the late-1940s. It was written up in the Church News at the time, by an occasional writer who you may have heard of. His name was Gordon B. Hinckley.

John said...

I've thought there could eventually be a temple in the Oakland/Susquehanna area for a long time. I don't know if it would be all that big - I could see it serving Scranton Pennsylvania Stake and a few stakes in New York, at least.

James said...

This may interest some of you: according to a new report from the Church Temples site today, the heart of the project manager for the Bangkok Thailand Temple became open to the gospel through overseeing the construction thereof. He has taken the missionary discussions and is preparing to be baptized this Saturday (it is already early in the morning of that day in Bangkok):

https://churchofjesuschristtemples.org/bangkok-thailand-temple/news/

I was deeply inspired by that report, so I wanted to pass it along here. Hopefully, that doesn't detract from the discussion about potential new temples. My thanks once again to you all.

Christopher Duerig said...

A little under the radar, and previously not on any of our Possible Temple sites lists, it was recently reported on the Church News and Newsroom sites. Elder Soares recently made a Ministerial visit among other places to LYON FRANCE to speak with the youth and missionaries there. Thoughts?

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders/2022/9/23/23368548/young-adults-in-portugal-and-france-encouraged-by-elder-soares-to-show-and-share-happiness

Also reported a visit to the Central Asian republic of Kazakhstan, where he spoke before a Congress of religious leaders and received a Medal from Kazakhstan President Kassym-Jomart Tokayev.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/elder-soares-seventh-congress-leaders-world-traditional-religion-kazakhstan

The Opinion said...

the topic of the new hymnal came up. here are two links from the church on the process and it will be a while. They are saying years before anything comes out.

https://www.thechurchnews.com/2020/11/10/23265168/hymnbook-revision-update-childrens-songbook-submissions-elder-soares

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/learn/new-music?lang=eng

James said...

I've kept up on the latest Church News updates for a while now. The Church News article you shared, which I read when it came out and a few times since, was published almost two years ago, which is about the same time at which the other link you shared with the FAQs referenced a process taking "several years". Since the latest update was two years ago, only those involved with the project today and the general leaders now overseeing the process, along with the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve would know what "several years" entails..Sister Franco, quoted in the article, was released from the Primary General Presidency in April of last year, and 4 months after that, Elder Ochoa started serving in the Mexico Area Presidency in August of that same year

So my point is that the last time we got any updates, general Church leaders who were involved at that time have been released or reassigned. Yes, it may still be "several years" before the new music is approved, but that could be subjective, and a lot could have happened in the almost two years since the last update on the new music.

My personal theory is that, since the new magazine editions were first published in 2021, 50 years after the last major magazine changes, that the new music will be published at some point in 2025, 40 years after the publication of the last new music in 1985, which would be "several years" after the updates you cited. Either way, with the last big update released almost 2 years ago, I'm surely not the only Church member wondering where that process is now. Hope that explains my theory about us possibly getting an update either way,.

Daniel Moretti said...

Lyon is three hours from Zollikofen via Geneva and four and a half hours from Le Chesnay via the French countryside. Considering that Toulouse will likely be served by Barcelona, ​​a temple for southern France in that city is as possible as a future temple in Milan for northern Italy.

Daniel Moretti said...

Friends, how should I use this chart? If there are 10, 12 or even 18 winners, and not just 2, is it still possible to use tournament logic with a final match between 2 participants?

Daniel Moretti said...

A question: in small temples where there is no cafeteria or large mechanical facilities and where the laundry is small, is the operating cost (caretaker, gardening and security) very high or almost similar to that of a meetinghouse? I believe the Church is looking not only to lower the costs of building temples but also to lower operating costs to make it possible to increase the number of buildings. Somehow, they need to be sustainable in the places where they are built.

Jim Anderson said...

They closed all the cafeterias earlier this year or maybe last, as they are no longer needed in a temple, some matters in some distant places are probably done as part of patron housing although I have no information on that. For most in the US, there are usually nearby restaurants or fast-food pads many within a mile or two of about any temple, that fact is the reason in part why they closed the cafeterias.

That said, and while I never had it, the parmesan trout that someone said they had at the Provo Temple, 'was to die for'. It was not cheap cafeteria food for the most part either.

Hank said...

The food was amazing.

I don't think the church is not looking for ways to make temples cheaper to build. They are looking for ways to make temples faster to build. If anything (like the modules) is more cost effective, that is only secondary to giving more access to more members as soon as possible. Temples that may not look as fancy as others are only built at a reduced cost because it makes sense in local economic conditions (including construction limitations).

John said...

The same thing that happened with the Bangkok temple, happened with the original construction of the Raleigh temple too.

Alex said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Alex said...

Here's my 2 cents.

Top 10 in US (no particular order)
Jacksonville, FL
Charlotte, NC
El Paso, TX
Queen Creek, AZ
Las Vegas, NV #2
Tacoma, WA
Cincinnati, OH
Colorado Springs, CO
Springville / Spanish Fork, UT
Fairbanks, AK
Honorable mention: Little Rock, AR; Des Moines, IA, Milwaukee, WI

Top 10 outside US (no particular order)
Maracaibo, Venezuela
Piura, Peru
Vina del Mar, Chile
Florianopolis, Brazil
Kampala, Uganda
Yamoussoukro, Cote d'Ivoire
Milan, Italy
Santiago, Philippines
Jakarta, Indonesia
Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia

Overall Top 10
1. Kampala Uganda
2. Charlotte, NC
3. Spanish Fork / Springville, UT
4. Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia
5. Tacoma, WA
6. Colorado Springs, CO
7. Maracaibo, Venezuela
8. Florionopolis, Brazil
9. Santiago, Philippines
10. Jacksonville, FL

And 8 more to get to 300.
11. Queen Creek, AZ
12. Las Vegas, NV #2
13. Fairbanks, AK
14. Yamoussoukro, CDI
15. Piura, Peru
16. Cincinnati, OH
17. El Paso, TX
18. Not one that would be expected but more of a historical site. If we're doing exactly 18 to get to 300, why not. Something like Harmony, PA. But otherwise, my real #18 would be Jakarta, Indonesia