Here in Michigan it has been over 40 years since a new stake was organized in the state. We have 8 stakes, and the time frame of organization is 27 years.
To be fair the Toledo Ohio Stake drew some of its units from the Ann Arbor Michigan Stake (the state libe then became the border) and the Green Bay Wisconsin stake organized in the 1990s took a district from Michigan.
The Traverse City Michigan District dates to the 1990s and may be close to becoming a stake.
Michigan may have gone the longest without getting a new stake of any multi-state state.
Michigan and its main city Detroit have lost more people to other places than few other places in the United States in the last 40 plus years. This goes back to compact, Japanese cars and higher OPEC oil prices causing the U.S. auto industry down size. Also, from my observation of Indiana or Purdue Universities compared to UM or MSU, prices and even climate seem more favorable than those towns, so more Latter-day Saint families would go to Indiana in those places than Michigam. This is anecdotal conjecture so I may be wrong. Making missionary inroads in the African-American community is an interesting one to me and a few others; while sensitive it is worth exploring. Indiana, my home state is 8 percent Black while I think Michigan is a bit higher, which can pose unique growth challenges to members, missionaries, and potential converts. Racism is an overused word very often, but cultural differences created by people of different backgrounds create impediments to growth as well. The famous Arab community of southeast Michigan must be challenging to find convert growth, whether those who are Muslim or Christian. Unfortunately racial and other ethnic differences are part of why unit and administrative growth can be hampered. For greater Michigan as the rest of the United States, there is the growth of those who are not interested in organized religion, which is huge, and those religious people strictly adherent to their former faiths. The Romneys, embodied in Mitt and sons, moved on from the Wolverine State (?) by the 1970s, and this state is an interesting case study in how the Church has had successes and challenges in growth. It is not all race and other cultural factors, as alluded to, but certainly economic and social demographic shifts have had a big impact on this very important state. I am very encouraged when I see more diversity enter the Church and its leadership, from South Asians to East Asians to Latinos, some other demographics not mentioned but having their parts in the U.S. and Michigan and Church growth. I hope and pray for future stakes and units to flourish in Michigan and its neighboring states and province. Some of this will be through immigration, I feel.
Speaking of Latinos, I had the thought when Elder Jorge Becerra was called in April that he might be the first Latino General Authority who was born in the US. The articles I saw did not mention that. Does anyone know?
Elder Becerra is not the first Latino General authority born in the US. That distinction arguably goes to Elder Clate W. Mask. Only one of Elder Mask's 4 grandparents was Latino and he did not learn Spanish until his mission despite the fact his one Latino grandfather was at one point a high school Spanish teacher, to both Camilla Eyring later Kimball and Marion G. Romney.
There are 2 current general authorities who are Latinos born in the US. Elder Ochoa and Elder Montoya.
Elder Ochoa was born in the US but raised in Mexico. He lived much of his adult life in Mexico but then moved to Utah. He was shortly after that called to the general Young men's presidency and later as a general authority seventy.
Elder Montoya was likewise born in the US. He was born in Fresno while Elder Ochoa was born in San Francisco. Elder Montoya is a direct descendant of Rafael Monroy the great martyr of Meixco who was killed in 1915 by revolutionaries in part for not renouncing The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Elder Montoya was however raised in Coborca, then almost the closest place in Mexico to the temple. This is because it is very near the Arizona border. As an adult he has lived elsewhere in Mexico. His wife is a convert from Caborca. Caborca has not yet gotten a stake. Elder Montoya was res8dent in Mexico at the time of his call.
Elder Becerra is the first lifelong US resident Latino who is unquestionably culturally Latino.
However just to show why this is not a big thing keep in mind Elder Juan Uceda who gave one of the prayers at general conference and is I believe current Central America Area President and was for a time in the presidency of the 70 makes things complex. Elder Uceda was born and lived most his life in Peru. He was head of the Church Educational System and Area Seventy there. For some reason he chose to leave that position and move to New Jersey and become involved in a family business. He was in New Jersey a member of a stake presidency. After living in New Jersey for a few years he was called as a general authority seventy.
I have not even gotten into the three US resident Latinas who have served as general officers if the Church, or tried to parse what Brother Camargo of the Sunday School General Presidency as a Brazilian resident in the US would be called.
Mitt Romney did abandon Muchigan, but that was before he had children at all.
His father George Romney was a regional representative here in 1980 and later was our stake patriarch. He was stake patriarch until his death in 1995.
G. Scott Romney is still an active member of my stake and was at my African-American mother-in-laws birthday party last year because at least at that point he and his wife were assigned as stake service missionaries to her ward.
One of the biggest construction companies in Michigan, Albridge Construction, which had the contract to build the Detroit Temple, is run by members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. In fact the current manager of the company is counsin to G. Scott Romney's oldest children. That is I believe John Rakolta III whose mother's sister is G. Scott Romney's ex-wife.
Detroit the city has declined, and Michigan had an overall net decline of population in both the 1980s and the 2000s. However it saw population growth in the 1990s.
Metro Detroit has also at times seen population growth. Michigan is 14% African-American to the US overall 13%.
The Church has made significant inroads in the African-American community in Michigan and flippant comments that ignore the amount of barriers that have been overcome to reach this point are off putting to those of us who have seen any of the struggle.
My grandson when he gets baptized next Febrary will be the 4th generation on his African-American mother's side to be baptized in the Church.
I actually do know that in 1964 the ward I am about to move to had an African-American Sunday School superintendent. I also know the stories of James Edwards who drove the bus for stake temple trips at a time when he could not go in the temple and was later bishop of the Detroit Ward. Despite what some tribunist nay sayers say, I am sure that James Edwards and other faithful Latter-day Saints in the US and not just the Martin's family and some other Brazilians were on President Kimball's mind as he inportuned the Lord in the Salt Lake Temple. I am also sure the faithful unbaptized Saints in Ghana and Nigeria were on his mind. I am not as sure if he was aware of the isolated Nugent family in Jamaica who had invited others to their non-sacrament meetings after the Americans who had taught and baptized them were forced out when Jamaica banned foreign workers.
If anyone watched through the inter-conference broadcast they would have come across a video entitled "Driven in Detroit". This video tried to capture what 8 mile means, and what transcending it means. It does not go into the ling history of Scott Lantz and his fight to have the Church transcend 8 Mile.
It is now a 6 year old film. There are a few scenes in there with my mother-in-law and one shot of my wife and oldest step daughter reading the scriptures. It has quotes from several people, some in my branch and some in the ward to our north and west. One of the men quoted extensively in the video and shown often with his wife and their niece they were partially raising has since died of cancer so it was in some ways a hard watch. The opening scenes that capture the grittiness of inner city Detroit are from Lamar Parker. This man with a very rough past was the last Young men's president in the ward to our North and West, and they realised his wife as relief society president when they made him young men's president. I suspect he is now a young men's advisor but I do not know for sure. The third African-American man most quoted in the film Solomon Bills, was the first president of my branch.
I have to admit we still have a long upward battle. I had coworkers just the other day express shock my wife is a black member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Church has made progress among Middle Easterners who people from outside Metro-Detrout would call Arabs. I had an Elders quorum president who was ethnically Chaldean, that is Assyrian Christian from Iraq whose family had historically been Roman Catholic. His parents joined the Church in Spain after fleeing the Iraq-Iran War but he may have been baptized in the US. When his family moved to Metro-Detroit there was another Chaldean family in the ward they ended up in.
That man's bother who was in another ward I was in is married to a woman who is a Colorex from Swaziland. I believe her father was a South African Afrikaans woman and her mother was half Swazi and half British. She lived in Durban for several years before coming to the US and on just seeing her and knowing she was from Durban knowing the demographics of Durban and seeing how she looked I at first assumed her ancestors were from India.
I over simplified her mother's tale. Her mother had two British grandfathers and two Swazi grandmothers. She had the same name and was good friends with a lady she met while here visiting her daughters ward. That lady was born in 1927 in Michigan and was one forth Chinese, although she didn't look it. If I had never known her I would not have guessed such people existed. Her mother was born in Arizona but her grandparents first met in Michigan in the 1890s in a mining camp. Her maternal grandfather was Chinese and her maternal grandmother Euro-American.
On the issue of the desirability of MSU and the University of Michigan verses state schools in Indiana I have some thoughts.
First Michigan has 15 public universities plus a lit of private institutions. My first scout master had a law degree from the University of Detroit, Mercy. His dad had moved to Michigan from Utah to work as a chemist when he was very young, he had gone to primary with his wife.
Adjacent to MSU is a complex of 2 apartment buildings owned by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints adjacent to an institute building. This is the only such complex anywhere. It was built through a bequest from Howard J. Stoddard who was head of Michigan National Bank. His grandson was at one point my institute teacher.
The University of Michigan in the late 19th century was one of the main areas that students from Utah went to study. Elder Joseph Merril, who was Gordon B. Hinckley's mission president was a UofM grad.
Bruce R. McConkie was born in Ann Arbor although his family left when he was an infant.
There are other connections. My stake center has on the wall the original plates for the Relief Society monument in Salt Lo lake City? Why? Because Avard Fairvanks when he made them was a member of the Detrout Ward, so they were in the Sorrento Chapel in Detroit until moved just before that chapel was demolished to build I-96. That stretch of I-96 is 12 lanes wide plus I believe 4 lanes of service drives. It is the one freeway in metro Deteout with separated by concrete barrier local and express lanes.
In 2000 55% of all African-Americans in Michigan lived within the city limits of Detroit. Detroit at 85% African-American was the most African-American of any of the US's 100 largest cities.
However less than 10% of the total population of Michigan lived in Detroit.
There are lots of factors at play against growth of the Church. Growing up in my ward it seemed most people had moved to Michigan because of the car industry, and with both my current branch and my parents ward being lead by a GM employee people are too quick to write off the auto industry.
If there is an industry that has abandoned Michigan it is the Phamaceutical Industry. At one point multi major pharmaceutical companies were based in Detroit. Two of them later moved to the suburbs and then in the 1990s moved all their operations to other states.
Lots of knowledge and insight, John P.L. Thank you! Your comment about flippant remarks in regards to race is correct. Sometimes it is a verbal comment that is wrong or offensive, or so many other cultural feax paus that happen. I'll give a personal example that is real but may or may not be illustrative of problems of communication either given or received. I will use the real first name and if she or others who know her read it, I pray that they see my love and concern in this, not any attempt to belittle or offend but to understand and act better. Darxavia was an African-American young single member from Chicago. I had known her for at least a year and considered her a friend and had spent time with her and some of her friends in formal and informal settings. One Sunday (likely the 3 hour block) I saw her and noticed a colorful I think orange streak in her otherwise dark hair. I wanted to compliment her on it and I said something like "Nice weave, I like it." Trying not to paint this two one sided, take with a pinch of salt, but she rather hostilely replied, "It is NOT a weave." I said, "I'm sorry, what is it called? (My point originally was I liked it and tried to convey my feeling of appreciation, attempt at warmth.) She still seemed miffed and was at a loss for the right word, which might be extension, but I am still not sure. I felt bad for apparently turning a compliment moment into what seemed to be an awkward or insensitive moment. Now, for more context, she was doing women's studies and doing a lot of research on misogyny and female self-perception and behavior, so maybe she would have responded in kind to anyone saying what I said and tried to communicate, male, female, black, white, Latino... Anyway, that interchange affected me and made me more cautious about how I spoke to her or others, and I sincerely pray and hope that she does not carry that with her as flippant or racist or offensive. Ignorant, sure, but well meaning in my intent. I hope she is well and happy (22 years later?)and not turned off by communication with people that may at first blush seem rude or unaware, but comes from a caring intent. But, as we all understand, different people understand and misinterpret messages and feelings all the time, and hopefully those differences do not impede Church activity and growth. But we are human and falter a lot, we must learn to apologize and forgive our many trespasses. That is why the Lord and the Gospel are so eternally great. While the country is nationally 13 percent Black, most states are not so close to that norm, like Michigan, but are above or below it. Like the average for Latter-day Saint populations, some states are 4 times greater than the national average, others are 4 times smaller, few are right on at 1.3 percent or whatever it is. Discussing demographic factors and cultural issues is helpful to me and some others, but some people take such talk as too judgmental or superior, condescending, racist, unnecessary, irrelevant. As a type of social scientist I find it fascinating and pertinent, and I hope others appreciate the pocket analysis and musings. My point about Mitt was that he left the state and took away his future family and presence, as I did with Indiana. Good to hear his extended family remains in the Midwest, as some of mine does.
10 comments:
Here in Michigan it has been over 40 years since a new stake was organized in the state. We have 8 stakes, and the time frame of organization is 27 years.
To be fair the Toledo Ohio Stake drew some of its units from the Ann Arbor Michigan Stake (the state libe then became the border) and the Green Bay Wisconsin stake organized in the 1990s took a district from Michigan.
The Traverse City Michigan District dates to the 1990s and may be close to becoming a stake.
Michigan may have gone the longest without getting a new stake of any multi-state state.
It appears that of late several new Portuguese speaking units have been organized in Utah.
Michigan and its main city Detroit have lost more people to other places than few other places in the United States in the last 40 plus years. This goes back to compact, Japanese cars and higher OPEC oil prices causing the U.S. auto industry down size.
Also, from my observation of Indiana or Purdue Universities compared to UM or MSU, prices and even climate seem more favorable than those towns, so more Latter-day Saint families would go to Indiana in those places than Michigam. This is anecdotal conjecture so I may be wrong.
Making missionary inroads in the African-American community is an interesting one to me and a few others; while sensitive it is worth exploring. Indiana, my home state is 8 percent Black while I think Michigan is a bit higher, which can pose unique growth challenges to members, missionaries, and potential converts. Racism is an overused word very often, but cultural differences created by people of different backgrounds create impediments to growth as well. The famous Arab community of southeast Michigan must be challenging to find convert growth, whether those who are Muslim or Christian.
Unfortunately racial and other ethnic differences are part of why unit and administrative growth can be hampered.
For greater Michigan as the rest of the United States, there is the growth of those who are not interested in organized religion, which is huge, and those religious people strictly adherent to their former faiths.
The Romneys, embodied in Mitt and sons, moved on from the Wolverine State (?) by the 1970s, and this state is an interesting case study in how the Church has had successes and challenges in growth.
It is not all race and other cultural factors, as alluded to, but certainly economic and social demographic shifts have had a big impact on this very important state.
I am very encouraged when I see more diversity enter the Church and its leadership, from South Asians to East Asians to Latinos, some other demographics not mentioned but having their parts in the U.S. and Michigan and Church growth.
I hope and pray for future stakes and units to flourish in Michigan and its neighboring states and province. Some of this will be through immigration, I feel.
Speaking of Latinos, I had the thought when Elder Jorge Becerra was called in April that he might be the first Latino General Authority who was born in the US. The articles I saw did not mention that. Does anyone know?
Elder Becerra is not the first Latino General authority born in the US. That distinction arguably goes to Elder Clate W. Mask. Only one of Elder Mask's 4 grandparents was Latino and he did not learn Spanish until his mission despite the fact his one Latino grandfather was at one point a high school Spanish teacher, to both Camilla Eyring later Kimball and Marion G. Romney.
There are 2 current general authorities who are Latinos born in the US. Elder Ochoa and Elder Montoya.
Elder Ochoa was born in the US but raised in Mexico. He lived much of his adult life in Mexico but then moved to Utah. He was shortly after that called to the general Young men's presidency and later as a general authority seventy.
Elder Montoya was likewise born in the US. He was born in Fresno while Elder Ochoa was born in San Francisco. Elder Montoya is a direct descendant of Rafael Monroy the great martyr of Meixco who was killed in 1915 by revolutionaries in part for not renouncing The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Elder Montoya was however raised in Coborca, then almost the closest place in Mexico to the temple. This is because it is very near the Arizona border. As an adult he has lived elsewhere in Mexico. His wife is a convert from Caborca. Caborca has not yet gotten a stake. Elder Montoya was res8dent in Mexico at the time of his call.
Elder Becerra is the first lifelong US resident Latino who is unquestionably culturally Latino.
However just to show why this is not a big thing keep in mind Elder Juan Uceda who gave one of the prayers at general conference and is I believe current Central America Area President and was for a time in the presidency of the 70 makes things complex. Elder Uceda was born and lived most his life in Peru. He was head of the Church Educational System and Area Seventy there. For some reason he chose to leave that position and move to New Jersey and become involved in a family business. He was in New Jersey a member of a stake presidency. After living in New Jersey for a few years he was called as a general authority seventy.
I have not even gotten into the three US resident Latinas who have served as general officers if the Church, or tried to parse what Brother Camargo of the Sunday School General Presidency as a Brazilian resident in the US would be called.
Mitt Romney did abandon Muchigan, but that was before he had children at all.
His father George Romney was a regional representative here in 1980 and later was our stake patriarch. He was stake patriarch until his death in 1995.
G. Scott Romney is still an active member of my stake and was at my African-American mother-in-laws birthday party last year because at least at that point he and his wife were assigned as stake service missionaries to her ward.
One of the biggest construction companies in Michigan, Albridge Construction, which had the contract to build the Detroit Temple, is run by members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. In fact the current manager of the company is counsin to G. Scott Romney's oldest children. That is I believe John Rakolta III whose mother's sister is G. Scott Romney's ex-wife.
Detroit the city has declined, and Michigan had an overall net decline of population in both the 1980s and the 2000s. However it saw population growth in the 1990s.
Metro Detroit has also at times seen population growth. Michigan is 14% African-American to the US overall 13%.
The Church has made significant inroads in the African-American community in Michigan and flippant comments that ignore the amount of barriers that have been overcome to reach this point are off putting to those of us who have seen any of the struggle.
My grandson when he gets baptized next Febrary will be the 4th generation on his African-American mother's side to be baptized in the Church.
I actually do know that in 1964 the ward I am about to move to had an African-American Sunday School superintendent. I also know the stories of James Edwards who drove the bus for stake temple trips at a time when he could not go in the temple and was later bishop of the Detroit Ward. Despite what some tribunist nay sayers say, I am sure that James Edwards and other faithful Latter-day Saints in the US and not just the Martin's family and some other Brazilians were on President Kimball's mind as he inportuned the Lord in the Salt Lake Temple. I am also sure the faithful unbaptized Saints in Ghana and Nigeria were on his mind. I am not as sure if he was aware of the isolated Nugent family in Jamaica who had invited others to their non-sacrament meetings after the Americans who had taught and baptized them were forced out when Jamaica banned foreign workers.
If anyone watched through the inter-conference broadcast they would have come across a video entitled "Driven in Detroit". This video tried to capture what 8 mile means, and what transcending it means. It does not go into the ling history of Scott Lantz and his fight to have the Church transcend 8 Mile.
It is now a 6 year old film. There are a few scenes in there with my mother-in-law and one shot of my wife and oldest step daughter reading the scriptures. It has quotes from several people, some in my branch and some in the ward to our north and west. One of the men quoted extensively in the video and shown often with his wife and their niece they were partially raising has since died of cancer so it was in some ways a hard watch. The opening scenes that capture the grittiness of inner city Detroit are from Lamar Parker. This man with a very rough past was the last Young men's president in the ward to our North and West, and they realised his wife as relief society president when they made him young men's president. I suspect he is now a young men's advisor but I do not know for sure. The third African-American man most quoted in the film Solomon Bills, was the first president of my branch.
I have to admit we still have a long upward battle. I had coworkers just the other day express shock my wife is a black member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Church has made progress among Middle Easterners who people from outside Metro-Detrout would call Arabs. I had an Elders quorum president who was ethnically Chaldean, that is Assyrian Christian from Iraq whose family had historically been Roman Catholic. His parents joined the Church in Spain after fleeing the Iraq-Iran War but he may have been baptized in the US. When his family moved to Metro-Detroit there was another Chaldean family in the ward they ended up in.
That man's bother who was in another ward I was in is married to a woman who is a Colorex from Swaziland. I believe her father was a South African Afrikaans woman and her mother was half Swazi and half British. She lived in Durban for several years before coming to the US and on just seeing her and knowing she was from Durban knowing the demographics of Durban and seeing how she looked I at first assumed her ancestors were from India.
I over simplified her mother's tale. Her mother had two British grandfathers and two Swazi grandmothers. She had the same name and was good friends with a lady she met while here visiting her daughters ward. That lady was born in 1927 in Michigan and was one forth Chinese, although she didn't look it. If I had never known her I would not have guessed such people existed. Her mother was born in Arizona but her grandparents first met in Michigan in the 1890s in a mining camp. Her maternal grandfather was Chinese and her maternal grandmother Euro-American.
On the issue of the desirability of MSU and the University of Michigan verses state schools in Indiana I have some thoughts.
First Michigan has 15 public universities plus a lit of private institutions. My first scout master had a law degree from the University of Detroit, Mercy. His dad had moved to Michigan from Utah to work as a chemist when he was very young, he had gone to primary with his wife.
Adjacent to MSU is a complex of 2 apartment buildings owned by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints adjacent to an institute building. This is the only such complex anywhere. It was built through a bequest from Howard J. Stoddard who was head of Michigan National Bank. His grandson was at one point my institute teacher.
The University of Michigan in the late 19th century was one of the main areas that students from Utah went to study. Elder Joseph Merril, who was Gordon B. Hinckley's mission president was a UofM grad.
Bruce R. McConkie was born in Ann Arbor although his family left when he was an infant.
There are other connections. My stake center has on the wall the original plates for the Relief Society monument in Salt Lo lake City? Why? Because Avard Fairvanks when he made them was a member of the Detrout Ward, so they were in the Sorrento Chapel in Detroit until moved just before that chapel was demolished to build I-96. That stretch of I-96 is 12 lanes wide plus I believe 4 lanes of service drives. It is the one freeway in metro Deteout with separated by concrete barrier local and express lanes.
In 2000 55% of all African-Americans in Michigan lived within the city limits of Detroit. Detroit at 85% African-American was the most African-American of any of the US's 100 largest cities.
However less than 10% of the total population of Michigan lived in Detroit.
There are lots of factors at play against growth of the Church. Growing up in my ward it seemed most people had moved to Michigan because of the car industry, and with both my current branch and my parents ward being lead by a GM employee people are too quick to write off the auto industry.
If there is an industry that has abandoned Michigan it is the Phamaceutical Industry. At one point multi major pharmaceutical companies were based in Detroit. Two of them later moved to the suburbs and then in the 1990s moved all their operations to other states.
Lots of knowledge and insight, John P.L. Thank you!
Your comment about flippant remarks in regards to race is correct. Sometimes it is a verbal comment that is wrong or offensive, or so many other cultural feax paus that happen.
I'll give a personal example that is real but may or may not be illustrative of problems of communication either given or received. I will use the real first name and if she or others who know her read it, I pray that they see my love and concern in this, not any attempt to belittle or offend but to understand and act better.
Darxavia was an African-American young single member from Chicago. I had known her for at least a year and considered her a friend and had spent time with her and some of her friends in formal and informal settings.
One Sunday (likely the 3 hour block) I saw her and noticed a colorful I think orange streak in her otherwise dark hair. I wanted to compliment her on it and I said something like "Nice weave, I like it." Trying not to paint this two one sided, take with a pinch of salt, but she rather hostilely replied, "It is NOT a weave."
I said, "I'm sorry, what is it called? (My point originally was I liked it and tried to convey my feeling of appreciation, attempt at warmth.) She still seemed miffed and was at a loss for the right word, which might be extension, but I am still not sure. I felt bad for apparently turning a compliment moment into what seemed to be an awkward or insensitive moment. Now, for more context, she was doing women's studies and doing a lot of research on misogyny and female self-perception and behavior, so maybe she would have responded in kind to anyone saying what I said and tried to communicate, male, female, black, white, Latino...
Anyway, that interchange affected me and made me more cautious about how I spoke to her or others, and I sincerely pray and hope that she does not carry that with her as flippant or racist or offensive. Ignorant, sure, but well meaning in my intent.
I hope she is well and happy (22 years later?)and not turned off by communication with people that may at first blush seem rude or unaware, but comes from a caring intent.
But, as we all understand, different people understand and misinterpret messages and feelings all the time, and hopefully those differences do not impede Church activity and growth. But we are human and falter a lot, we must learn to apologize and forgive our many trespasses. That is why the Lord and the Gospel are so eternally great.
While the country is nationally 13 percent Black, most states are not so close to that norm, like Michigan, but are above or below it. Like the average for Latter-day Saint populations, some states are 4 times greater than the national average, others are 4 times smaller, few are right on at 1.3 percent or whatever it is.
Discussing demographic factors and cultural issues is helpful to me and some others, but some people take such talk as too judgmental or superior, condescending, racist, unnecessary, irrelevant.
As a type of social scientist I find it fascinating and pertinent, and I hope others appreciate the pocket analysis and musings.
My point about Mitt was that he left the state and took away his future family and presence, as I did with Indiana. Good to hear his extended family remains in the Midwest, as some of mine does.
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